My Conversation with Mark Karpeles of MtGox
- Thread starter Jon
- Start date
Because I have read a lot on the subject, I understand what is driving bitcoin's growth, (the 3-pillar thing again) and so far I have not run across a single scenario (short of one involving aliens) that has what it takes to defeat that incredibly strong growth. (Which has an equally strong momentum.)
When other things like cellphones or the internet benefitted from the network effect, they lacked the added financial incentives that bitcoin enjoys. Nothing has ever existed that will have as strong of a network effect as bitcoin will.
Most of your arguments don't make any sense because they are talking about completely different systems/goods that are ESSENTIAL in our life. Do we need water to survive? Hell yes, we will surely be drinking it in a few years. What's going to replace water? It's been around since forever and your claim that Bitcoin is equal to water is just blatantly wrong. Bitcoin is not the non-plus ultra, it is an amazing piece of technology, but it still has flaws that have yet to be solved before it becomes our standardized form of payment processing.
I've seen one of your posts above about HTTP not being replaceable and comparing it with Bitcoin. Has there been any compelling technology with the potential to replace HTTP (and therefore requiring all servers/web browsers to adapt and take the effort to change the current normed protocol)? Definitely not. It is much harder to replace something standardized, with a higher entry-barrier and where the user has little input in deciding what needs to change than something that has yet to grow and where the user can freely decide what they want to use.
The entry barrier for an altcoin is insanely low and really anyone can make their own currency. The low entry barrier does absolutely not guarantee that another dominant player will evolve, but that does not erase the possibility, that a new, better project will establish and replace the system it evolved out of.
Bitcoin is not essential (far from it, yet) and it still has to change a lot to be able to attract the masses. And I guess your point comes from the statement "in the future, everyone will be using Bitcoin to purchase over the internet without even realizing it". Are we there yet? Nope. Can another, faster, better solution replace Bitcoin and become the invisible payment processor of the internet that EVERYONE will be using? YES.
Hahaha, oh Luke, you really think that you are the only one on this forum that can be treated as a Bitcoin-expert. Once you start to be more objective and able to realize what's going on, I think we would have some very interesting conversations between the 2 of us.
So let me elaborate on the current flaws of Bitcoin:
- Mining is currently concentrated to a few pools (Selfish mining)
- Inefficient mining algorithm (energy waste) which leads to centralization due to ASIC miners dominating the space
- Bigger requirements to scale the tps and efficiency of the network
- Long transaction confirmation time
- For BTC to become a currency, it needs to fight the current banking system which is in cozy relations with government officials. And it not only needs to do that in one country, but world-wide. (I am not stating that this is not possible, protests would have to happen. But it is a huge huge target).
- High entry barrier
- Deflationary problems which leads to the high volatility problem we currently suffer (and will suffer in the next months/years)
- Not feasible for the "masses" right now because storing all your money on a file on your computer that can be easily retrieved by malware is definitely not appealing (More to that below)
- No customer protection. Now you may be thinking "But dude, that's what Bitcoin is all about, no chargebacks!", now does the average consumer care about this? Nope. What he wants is a solution that gives him the security that he will either get his good or his money back. (P2SH wallets are great though)
These are just a few flaws (of the top of my head) that the Bitcoin community has to face before prospering and achieving its ambitious goals. Am I stating that this is not do-able? Far from it, most of them are very do-able but it takes time for Bitcoin to evolve, grow and become the internet standard in payment processing.
This reshaping and product iteration is done by 2 parties: The core devs and startups. The core devs are doing a great job - but they are mostly hobbyists and only a few are working full-time on the project. But they are lacking resources and it is possible for another team, working on a completely separate project (opposed tcolored coins etc.) to basically overrun BTC and bring new technology faster to the market. That's what open-source is for: Innovation happens at a much faster pace and basically anyone is invited to contribute.
And the other party is the startups or lets say the ecosystem which is being built around Bitcoin. These guys are much more important than the core devs in the sense that they are solving problems that can not be solved by Bitcoin itself. They are the ones lowering the entry barrier, working on education (which is still the biggest problem by far) and creating products that try to integrate Bitcoin in peoples every day life. But this again leads to problems of centralization, trust and insecurity that another startup that wants to ride on the Bitcoin train to make money is losing millions of dollars.
This definitely does not attract new users and a lot needs to happen in regards to Bitcoin itself, the problems of centralization and the problems of trust and protection for customers.
Now for Bitcoin to really take off it not only needs to appeal to users and the visionaries as us, but it needs to appeal to governments. Bitcoin needs to create a plausible situation in which everyone wins without having to fight for its cause. Does it help the community if an Amir Taaki rages about Banks and how they will be destroyed in the future? Absolutely not. This requires diplomacy, this is not a radical movement.
The statement that the network effect will secure Bitcoin's future is illogical. History has shown that the "network effect" can be replicated, and will be replicated by the superior service.
First mover advantage is also just a temporary advantage in the sense that you have some leverage in regards to product iteration/testing and early customer acquisition. This does by no means imply that someone with a better and bigger idea won't innovate on top of your success and overrun you.
I find it funny the way your arguments are structured. You basically try to prove the other person wrong by all means without cross-checking your own arguments.
Yes, there are thousands of teams of working on Bitcoin alternatives. But only a dozen can be taken serious. All the others are just playing the usual hype pump and dump game in which the creator of the coin becomes insanely rich. None of these AltCoins bring value to the table or offer solutions that can not be solved by Bitcoin itself. Litecoin is by no means Bitcoin 2.0, it is simply an alternative that is on par with Bitcoin: No major innovation or improvements to Bitcoins core value.
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Now here is my conclusion, by no means am I a naysayer to Bitcoin - it's actually the complete opposite. I am an advocate and an activist, an entrepreneur (the same as you I suppose) that wants to see changes happen in our society and our current financial systems. I, the same as you, took this challenge in my own hands to not only participate, but to accelerate this process by creating something that will help the population be aware of this product and adopt it in their every day life.
I have a team of more than 8 people now, I have hardware guys that created this tool (and which we are going to open-source soon) Bitcoin POS Terminal - Imgur , I am incorporated in the best country in the world and have all the licenses required to go big, I am expanding in China to offer our solutions to the market and I will receive a substantial investment in one of my products next week.
Why am I doing all this? I believe in a future and the technology behind Bitcoin. And I believe that we can achieve a lot more in regards to economic and social equality and fairness. I believe in the idea and want to help the movement with my own vision of the future and want to contribute to all of this.
I am not going to join this argument anymore as arguments are never a solution and lead to more splitting than consensus. In general, me and you are wasting our precious time by arguing about the future. Neither you and me can predict it. But we can influence it - and we surely won't create our own destiny by arguing and standing our point. Prove it to the masses with your products/ideas and you will have achieved a lot more. But just start to think more objectively and don't be driven by your own desire. Think of what the population wants to see. Nobody will care if the Bitcoins you have been hoarding for the past years will drive past $1000 again. Bitcoin is not meant to be there to be hoarded in your wallet as a value storage.
"If you argue and rankle and contradict, you may achieve a victory sometimes; but it will be an empty victory because you will never get your opponent's will." - Ben Franklin
In that sense, we should move our ass and get back to work. Not fight against each other but create products that change humanity.
I gotta say that Cigar is far more objective and neutral on the subject of bitcoins. He doesn't let bias and emotion cloud his judgment unlike Lukep. That was an excellent post Cigar.
I think Cigar is probably one of the true Bitcoin experts on this forum while Lukep is an extremely biased wannabe. LukeP always had a big problem with confirmation bias, and this problem is really clear to the objective observer when seeing his reactions to bitcoin: he waves away bad news and inflates the value of good news. He also doesn't know what he's talking about most of the time, and just repeats talking points he read elsewhere. There's zero critical thinking going on in his head.
Either way cryptocurency is here to stay, but I doubt that bitcoin will ever be a global reserve currency.
Bitcoin needs less babbling evangelicals like Lukep and more objective experts like Cigar.
I think Cigar is probably one of the true Bitcoin experts on this forum while Lukep is an extremely biased wannabe. LukeP always had a big problem with confirmation bias, and this problem is really clear to the objective observer when seeing his reactions to bitcoin: he waves away bad news and inflates the value of good news. He also doesn't know what he's talking about most of the time, and just repeats talking points he read elsewhere. There's zero critical thinking going on in his head.
Either way cryptocurency is here to stay, but I doubt that bitcoin will ever be a global reserve currency.
Bitcoin needs less babbling evangelicals like Lukep and more objective experts like Cigar.
I'm involved in most of the bitcoin 2.0 projects and am basically seeing it from the inside. As amazing as these technologies may claim to be - you have to stay skeptic and take everything with a grain of salt. Base your beliefs (and hope) on them once they actually proved themselves. Bitcoin has the advantage that it has already proved itself and has shown to the world that it works and that there is demand for it (i.e. there is a market). These new projects have to prove themselves, but time will tell on who will succeed and perpetuate their name in our minds.
In an argument always let the other person "save face". Luke is a nice guy, he's enthusiastic and has a vision. I hope that he will contribute to this whole synergy and succeed in his endeavor. Am always open to contributions and cooperations. As it is with every startup, you are surrounded by uncertainty. In the Bitcoin startup scene this uncertainty is amplified due to unclear regulations. But I'm confident that things will change.
Btw my name is Dominik. Should probably change my name as being called "Cigar" sounds awkward lol.
I couldn't agree more with you, on pretty much everything you said.
I wish more Bitcoin supporters were like you, than radical revolutionists that want to overthrow currencies and governments. I support many libertarian concepts, but they're not the way to try and win widespread adoption of something.
As I've said time and time again, LukeP needs to separate his political beliefs from the way he promotes Bitcoin. By combining the two you only confuse, or lead to political arguments which are actually irrelevant to the success of it.
The way to make Bitcoin big isn't by spouting on about the downfall of fiat or a replacement currency/overthrowing governments, but promoting all the great things you can do with it, that are currently impossible. The focus on libertarian messages by bitcoin start-up founders, developers, etc only serves to slow its adoption.
Most people don't want to overthrow governments, or think there's a problem with fiat currency. Much more than that, they actively distrust everything the people that suggest that should happen's words (for better or worse).
Excellent. This is a most welcome turn of events! Thank you Dominik for speaking up.
Do you realize that in 2 whole years now, despite me not being the first bitcoiner in here, I've been the only one to identify myself as knowing anything about bitcoin?
For that whole time, bitcoin threads would pop up on a weekly basis or even more often, and no one would want to answer the questions or set the record straight! It always fell to me after that damn 5k post. I feel like Lucille Ball at the chocolate factory conveyor belt!
Consider yourself on WF bitcoin evangelist duty. It's tough work but you sound like you can handle it... I've needed a fucking break since the day I got back from my last one!
About my anarchist slant on the subject, I honestly don't feel any need to convince anyone here to embrace anarchy along with bitcoin... I'd rather just have them all join the bitcoin economy in the way they feel comfortable.
It just happens that when answering questions, I am answering it from the way I understand it, which apparently turns off some statelovers like bluechinagroup & mituozo. Now that you're here, I hope these ppl listen to you and get into bitcoin quicker that way.
Vacation time, suckas!
P.S. Awesome open POS hardware! If that was your idea, you're more of an anarchist than you think you are.
Do you realize that in 2 whole years now, despite me not being the first bitcoiner in here, I've been the only one to identify myself as knowing anything about bitcoin?
For that whole time, bitcoin threads would pop up on a weekly basis or even more often, and no one would want to answer the questions or set the record straight! It always fell to me after that damn 5k post. I feel like Lucille Ball at the chocolate factory conveyor belt!
Consider yourself on WF bitcoin evangelist duty. It's tough work but you sound like you can handle it... I've needed a fucking break since the day I got back from my last one!
About my anarchist slant on the subject, I honestly don't feel any need to convince anyone here to embrace anarchy along with bitcoin... I'd rather just have them all join the bitcoin economy in the way they feel comfortable.
It just happens that when answering questions, I am answering it from the way I understand it, which apparently turns off some statelovers like bluechinagroup & mituozo. Now that you're here, I hope these ppl listen to you and get into bitcoin quicker that way.
Vacation time, suckas!
P.S. Awesome open POS hardware! If that was your idea, you're more of an anarchist than you think you are.
I'm certain it's not Satoshi, for these reasons:
Investigations and observations - Home - Newsweek uncovers its own lack of integrity in alleged
Poor old scapegoat, he'll be murdered for that supposed billion dollars within the week... Maybe the threat of such will drive out the real satoshi.
This was the Journalistic fuckup of the century. I hope Newsweek offices get burned to the ground.
Great that we came to a conclusion.
I am far from being an expert, I'm just a normal kid trying to do his thing and bring clarity where he can. I won't be active on this forum but will try to participate in interesting discussions.
And you should definitely not stop but continue being a BTC advocate and proposing it to friends/family and to people on the internet. I totally feel for your "suffering" in the past few years, it is hard to convince of your intentions whom you don't see and basically know nothing about. Education and the way it is communicated is by far the biggest issue today, but there are some great people work on it. As usual, everything takes time but we will get to the point where my 50 year old italian mom (that can't turn on a PC...) will use Bitcoins to pay for her groceries. (Fun fact: That is actually the internal goal of our education team.)
Regarding the POS System: I did not create it, but I rather convinced the creators behind it (This is what I've been working on for the past few months: A Bitcoin POS Terminal from scratch : Bitcoin) to join our team instead of creating his own company and work with us in Switzerland. The 2 guys behind it are brilliant guys and there is a lot to come in the future.
In the coming months, after having everything set-up in Switzerland, we will jump to India and get into serious talks with regulators there and articulate the benefits of crypto-currencies and the billions of dollars that the country is missing by not embracing this new technology and the ever-growing ecosystem around it. We have great connections there so lets see what can be done.
The actual goal for you and me, as Bitcoin activists and entrepreneurs, is it to create products that can be treated as "transition-products" in the sense that they are centralized (Yeh I know, boooo!) but help citizens all around the globe to easily and seamlessly transfer to the beautiful world of decentralized, trustless systems.
My guess is that we can say "mission accomplished" in around 20 - 40 years, which includes new financial and social systems all around the globe that bring prosperity, equality and fairness to everyone.
The more people that join and participate in the movement, the faster we get where we want to be. As it is with politics and business in general, it is all about allocating your resources to the right location at the right time - so instead of "rushing" it, we need to think ahead and plan every step we make. One mistake or one wrong word can screw everything up and we will have to start from zero.
But everyone on this forum can agree to this: Things will change!
For the record, I believe in a smaller state. I'm not a "statelover".
I'm not even saying I disagree with your political views (neither am I saying I agree with them). My single point is that you need to detach them from your promotion of Bitcoin to gain widespread acceptance.
Your actual beliefs, and mine, are irrelevant. By mixing your political beliefs in with your belief in bitcoin you just put up another potential block to people embracing bitcoin (because a proportion of the people you speak to won't have the same political ideologies as you).
It's like me trying to start a religion, but saying that you have to be a libertarian to join it (even though the religion is nothing to do with libertarianism). It's stupid, and vastly reduces the volume of people you can influence.
Most people don't see fiat currency as bad, or having the huge problems you think it has (irrespective of whether you think that's right or wrong, or whether it is objectively right or wrong -- it's what IS). By pitching Bitcoin as something that will overthrow it, you alienate the majority of people. In fact, they see that as a bad thing, and will therefore be less likely to embrace it.
It's good that you've introduced WF and tons of people on this forum to BTC, I just wish you'd be a bit more politically objective when you talk to people about the perceived benefits of it. If you can't do that, you're just going to end up in debate after debate surrounding the practicalities of anarcho capitalism and whether Bitcoin is really a mechanism for driving that change or not.
When I was really young in the 70s someone told me that in the future we wouldn't use money at all, that it would be conscribed to the history books. That we as a whole planet would work together finally towards progress of the human race and its survival.
I wish I could remember who that person was, but I was too young at the time to correlate names, faces and detail so despite my best efforts I honestly can't recall who it was!* Irks me today sometimes.
One thing I will say though - I am so glad that I live in this day and age where we are seeing the birth of a new era. I don't mean bitcoin specifically, but the whole world communicating, transacting and interacting like we've never seen before. I’m certain that some WF folk must have been around and used the first micro-computers, and indeed previous machines like RMLs… back then if you knew this was the future you’d probably have cried tears of joy. It's fucking amazing really.
Cryptocurrency is another stage in this evolution** and it's a wonderful thing to see happening. One of the nicest parts of this is that there really hasn't had to be a huge technological upheaval . Certainly no physical /network upheaval - it can happily sit on top of existing infrastructure TCP/IP based networks… just programming / protocol. The transport for it is already in place. The roads in place. Just the cargo that needs changing.
It’s a conceptual thing and a way to change people’s ideas about how we transact with each other, and that’s what I like about it. The important part that I can see is that cryptocurrency has been created and it’s here to stay - in which ever name, form or method that it takes.
My view is that at this stage it is adolescent and behaving badly at times - there are no real “traditional” parents to keep it in check after all. Muggings are happening and there’s no back up for the losers.
I strongly oppose the concept or idea of centralisation or regulation in any way, shape or form, but generally people won’t walk down a dark alley if there’s no back up. - I don't think it will be an easy task to convince the non-tech-savy people to adopt it. Perhaps the thing to do is to make those dark alleys slightly safer and convince people they’re not bad places by putting streetlights along them? Maybe throw in a couple of (btc?)cafes too just for extra reassurance?
You'll have to excuse me for this monologue - the haze crop turned out far better than expected it seems.
*I've always had poor memory anyway - it's why I studied mnemonics.
**Apologies to any folk who don't believe in evolution.
I wish I could remember who that person was, but I was too young at the time to correlate names, faces and detail so despite my best efforts I honestly can't recall who it was!* Irks me today sometimes.
One thing I will say though - I am so glad that I live in this day and age where we are seeing the birth of a new era. I don't mean bitcoin specifically, but the whole world communicating, transacting and interacting like we've never seen before. I’m certain that some WF folk must have been around and used the first micro-computers, and indeed previous machines like RMLs… back then if you knew this was the future you’d probably have cried tears of joy. It's fucking amazing really.
Cryptocurrency is another stage in this evolution** and it's a wonderful thing to see happening. One of the nicest parts of this is that there really hasn't had to be a huge technological upheaval . Certainly no physical /network upheaval - it can happily sit on top of existing infrastructure TCP/IP based networks… just programming / protocol. The transport for it is already in place. The roads in place. Just the cargo that needs changing.
It’s a conceptual thing and a way to change people’s ideas about how we transact with each other, and that’s what I like about it. The important part that I can see is that cryptocurrency has been created and it’s here to stay - in which ever name, form or method that it takes.
My view is that at this stage it is adolescent and behaving badly at times - there are no real “traditional” parents to keep it in check after all. Muggings are happening and there’s no back up for the losers.
I strongly oppose the concept or idea of centralisation or regulation in any way, shape or form, but generally people won’t walk down a dark alley if there’s no back up. - I don't think it will be an easy task to convince the non-tech-savy people to adopt it. Perhaps the thing to do is to make those dark alleys slightly safer and convince people they’re not bad places by putting streetlights along them? Maybe throw in a couple of (btc?)cafes too just for extra reassurance?
You'll have to excuse me for this monologue - the haze crop turned out far better than expected it seems.
*I've always had poor memory anyway - it's why I studied mnemonics.
**Apologies to any folk who don't believe in evolution.
To LukeP or anyone else involved heavily in Bitcoin. Just received this message in my VaultofSatoshi trading account. Big deal and a sign of whats to come or no big deal?:
It is with great regret to inform you that we will be ceasing our US operations effective today. If you reside outside the United States this does not affect you.
We’ve made this decision not because of any specific legal challenge or threat, but because we feel the regulatory environment in the US is becoming increasingly hostile toward Bitcoin, and more specifically toward exchanges trading in digital currencies. We’re heeding the warnings of Bitcoin Foundation and BitInstant founder, Charlie Shrem, who recently conducted a troubling interview with “Let’s Talk Bitcoin.” If you want to hear more about the situation exchanges face operating in the US, we recommend you listen to episode 87 of “Let’s Talk Bitcoin” here: E87 – The Captive and The Mountain | Lets Talk Bitcoin
We’ve made repeated attempts to comply with FinCEN regulations, but their online form submission process will not allow us to post reports from our headquarters in Ontario, Canada. They refuse to accept printed paper reports, and their drop-downs don’t include Canadian options, making it impossible to the file the required documentation properly in order to comply. Despite repeated inquiries into how to properly file reports from Canada, we have yet to receive a satisfactory response. They’ve literally made it impossible for us to run our business in compliance with their regulations.
We make this decision with a heavy heart, and will be revisiting it as we continue to monitor the regulatory and legal position of the US government (and all of its individual States) towards digital currency exchanges. Each State has their own requirements for how to handle a business like ours, and the setup and compliance costs are astronomical. We’d like to get back into the US digital currency exchange market as soon as possible, but cannot do so until the regulatory situation is clarified and settles down. We will be exploring re-launching on a state-by-state basis, but we do not yet have a timeline in place.
If you are a US-based customer, unfortunately your account will soon be demoted to level 1, and you will be limited to coin-to-coin trading, which will be launching within the coming weeks. Any dollars currently in your account will be refunded to you via check, which you should receive within 2-3 weeks’ time. Please make sure your address is correct.
If you’re a US-based customer and have recently submitted documents for verification, unfortunately, we will not be able to verify your account at this time.
To all of the amazing American users who have helped us build Vault of Satoshi into what it is today: we value you tremendously and we hope that we have not lost your trust and support. We deeply regret that we can no longer service your cryptocurrency exchange needs, and we’ll do everything we can to re-gain your business and re-launch in your country in the near future, stronger than ever before.
To Canadian and International users, we’ve got exciting plans ahead and are continuing our to expand and cement our position in this industry. Stay tuned for more amazing innovations from our team here in Canada.
Thank you once again for your incredible and humbling support.
It is with great regret to inform you that we will be ceasing our US operations effective today. If you reside outside the United States this does not affect you.
We’ve made this decision not because of any specific legal challenge or threat, but because we feel the regulatory environment in the US is becoming increasingly hostile toward Bitcoin, and more specifically toward exchanges trading in digital currencies. We’re heeding the warnings of Bitcoin Foundation and BitInstant founder, Charlie Shrem, who recently conducted a troubling interview with “Let’s Talk Bitcoin.” If you want to hear more about the situation exchanges face operating in the US, we recommend you listen to episode 87 of “Let’s Talk Bitcoin” here: E87 – The Captive and The Mountain | Lets Talk Bitcoin
We’ve made repeated attempts to comply with FinCEN regulations, but their online form submission process will not allow us to post reports from our headquarters in Ontario, Canada. They refuse to accept printed paper reports, and their drop-downs don’t include Canadian options, making it impossible to the file the required documentation properly in order to comply. Despite repeated inquiries into how to properly file reports from Canada, we have yet to receive a satisfactory response. They’ve literally made it impossible for us to run our business in compliance with their regulations.
We make this decision with a heavy heart, and will be revisiting it as we continue to monitor the regulatory and legal position of the US government (and all of its individual States) towards digital currency exchanges. Each State has their own requirements for how to handle a business like ours, and the setup and compliance costs are astronomical. We’d like to get back into the US digital currency exchange market as soon as possible, but cannot do so until the regulatory situation is clarified and settles down. We will be exploring re-launching on a state-by-state basis, but we do not yet have a timeline in place.
If you are a US-based customer, unfortunately your account will soon be demoted to level 1, and you will be limited to coin-to-coin trading, which will be launching within the coming weeks. Any dollars currently in your account will be refunded to you via check, which you should receive within 2-3 weeks’ time. Please make sure your address is correct.
If you’re a US-based customer and have recently submitted documents for verification, unfortunately, we will not be able to verify your account at this time.
To all of the amazing American users who have helped us build Vault of Satoshi into what it is today: we value you tremendously and we hope that we have not lost your trust and support. We deeply regret that we can no longer service your cryptocurrency exchange needs, and we’ll do everything we can to re-gain your business and re-launch in your country in the near future, stronger than ever before.
To Canadian and International users, we’ve got exciting plans ahead and are continuing our to expand and cement our position in this industry. Stay tuned for more amazing innovations from our team here in Canada.
Thank you once again for your incredible and humbling support.
The biggest problem with all of these startups is the regulatory uncertainty. Right now only a few countries have really started looking into Bitcoin and started to treat it more seriously (such as Switzerland, where we are based).
It is hard to fight against a kleptocracy, where big corporations and banks work tightly together with politicians to build the framework they want. But I see things that will perhaps change in the coming months. The NYC hearing was very positive and Ben Lawsky even took the time to make a reddit AMA As Requested, I .
People, especially high state officials, start to understand what Bitcoin really is and what it offers to their current, inefficient systems. But changes in most countries have yet to happen.
In regards to VaultofSatoshi, in general, it is very difficult for a gambling service to operate, especially in the US (where again, the big casino empires are trying very hard to keep online gambling away from the population). Today most of the gambling sites are blocked in the US and it is very difficult to send money to one (as banks, by law, are not allowed to operate with gambling services).
So yeh, the solution to this is to move out of the US or to wait. It'll take a lot of time for policies to be changes and adapted to Bitcoin, and maybe a "Bitlicense" for an exchange to operate in the US will be created. Right now, an exchange requires a federal MSB license and MTB licenses in all 50 states, which require up to $7m in bonds and take 14 - 20 months to acquire. Definitely not feasible in todays fast moving markets.
The US has already realized that they can not stop Bitcoin (search for e-Gold and what happened to the creator) so I do think, and most importantly, I hope, that they realize that they HAVE to embrace this new technology and great a regulatory framework that keeps the entry barrier at a moderate rate and allows for innovation to happen.
If the US fails to understand this, it'll miss out on trillions of dollars and countries such as Switzerland are coming to new heights.
you're higher than 15 hippies. that's so laughable its not worth discussing. and i thought lukep was the used car salesman....
"yes, they CAN NOT STOP IT."
"yes, they HAVE TO EMBRACE IT."
lol. its like cult shit with these bozos.