Martin Grunin - Facebook Ads Fraud - Bank Fraud - mgrunin

[jriddick]

Fucking hypocrites.

Best of luck, Martin.

I don't think you got my point. My point was that people here who scam other with rebills for a living are saying what mgrunin did was wrong yet have no issue making up fake stories about people losing weight with shitty diet pills.

and just wow.....looks like you're saying if mgrunin was humble , it makes a 350k scam more acceptable.

This and this.

McGrunin will have to face the consequences for his actions, but he was always a class act to those here.

There are many here who do far scummier things and do all sorts of posing, yet suddenly they team up to play the Pharisee and lecture us all on McGrunin's moral shortcomings?

Bitch, please. Half of you are 10 times the scumbag McGrunin is. This kind of kicking a man when he's down makes me sick.

 

[poopie]

What I'd really like to know is what evidence was actually collected to make this stand up in court? If it's like everyone here is saying, the sky is literally falling, jail, felonies, fraud etc...Someone tell me WHY the fuck didn't facebook go to the police/FBI, they go after crimes in the 10~K, wouldn't they have stepped up to the plate to help collect evidence PRE waving a giant red flag so Grunin has time to wipe most of it?

How can they prove it was Grunin sitting at the computer/registering those accounts? Unless they had a secret warrant to collect evidence pre-trial, what's to stop him from wiping most of such evidence?

If they can't prove the above beyond reasonable doubt, wouldn't the case falter? Is the plan just to slam everything they think he did against him and go for some kind of plea deal to get a precedent or example out of him?

Grunin seemed like a smart guy, did he really think he was above getting nailed for doing something on this scale, what was his exit plan? He seemed to genuinely enjoy helping out other members here, sure his ego was a bit much, but at least he got a lot of people thinking about money/investing... This isn't saying anything evidence wise, but it begs the question 'why bother?' Was WF in for a long con stemming from years of rep building, really?

Why does half of FB's lawsuit include bits from their TOS? TOS's aren't the law, and they're very shaky in courts. Are they hoping to create precedents to legitimize them with this case? If so that means all of us here are susceptible to a slew of additional laws that are every bit as legitimate as standard ones simply for a 1 second action of clicking OK on a website TOS that no one ever reads, a bit scary eh?

Nearly everyone put their favorite pair of righteous panties when the only thing we have to go on is a well written statement by FB and a NYPost article. I'd agree with most of you, if we could make a reasonable assessment of the proof.

Either way, cases like this are another hit against the IM industry, no greater repercussions can come than from the likes of corporations with endless money and governments with endless hopes of creating new laws, tit for tat.

Well, for one thing they have Grunin's attempts to sell the accounts on forums. They have his thinksmodo IP; the FRB wire info; Grunin engaging in wire (email) and bank fraud (fake Imprezzo bank statements); and lastly, you're really fucking stupid.

 

[shindig]

My roommate 9 years ago stole my wallet and spent $3500, took out contracts in my name for cell phones and shit, he got 8 years. (4 suspended but hang over him if he fucks up probation after he gets out)

There's a big difference between exploiting affiliate schemes (cookie stuffing) and actually impersonating people to take out lines of credit in their name for six figures...

 

[Hurr-Durr]

This and this.

McGrunin will have to face the consequences for his actions, but he was always a class act to those here.

There are many here who do far scummier things and do all sorts of posing, yet suddenly they team up to play the Pharisee and lecture us all on McGrunin's moral shortcomings?

Bitch, please. Half of you are 10 times the scumbag McGrunin is. This kind of kicking a man when he's down makes me sick.

I don't think moral arguments belong on WF in the first place so I'm only speaking from a common-sense perspective and to that extent, I agree with you. So it's pointless to judge whether pushing rebills is more unethical than impersonating identities.

The one and only point here is that how could a person who seems reasonably smart and hard-working (I think we can all agree Grunin was motivated) be so STUPID. This isn't even a stupidity like negligence. This isn't like forgetting to insure your million dollar car or running over a homeless guy while you were drunk. This is stupidity on a whole new level - GOING OUT OF YOUR WAY TO SAY SOMEONE WHO YOU AREN'T IN ORDER TO STEAL MONEY/SERVICE FROM ONE OF THE BIGGEST COMPANIES IN THE WORLD.

Again, I'm not saying what's right or wrong (each person should judge so himself, and draw his own boundaries) - but if you're based out of Russia or if you are doing it to smaller companies you might believe you could get away with it. But living in a spotlight right here in USA and doing it to facebook? I couldn't come up with a faster way to get caught, even if I wanted to! That's beyond the realm of absurd and into the realm of madness! This is like a guy who shows off his mansion, his cars, his jet...then we all discover that he is a professional bank robber during the day.

--

The feds will have a field day scalping WF for evidence. Especially posts like this one.

 

[galacon]

Seven, count 'em, (7) pages in one day.

Oh how sweet, when the mighty fall.

Hate to say I told you so, but...

Groanin, get ready for the REAL big time, bitch.

And @ jriddick: fuck you, retard. You deserve every WSO you ever bought, pusbag.

Good Luck, Asshole.

 

[Your_Pal]

Posting in the epic thread of year. Kudos to Jon for explaining it.

Lots of lesson to be learned in this thread.

 

[testcase714]

Just so you guys know he was hacked and...

 

[jriddick]

how could a person who seems reasonably smart and hard-working be so STUPID?

A stupid person wouldn't have been able to pull something like that off. It's a brand of brazen recklessness and believing you won't get caught, which is more a form of blindness. Perhaps he was blinded by the money, or the fame, or the thirst for the admiration of others. We'll probably never know.

McGrunin will pay the price for the actions he committed, and it may turn out to be a very steep price indeed.

But he was a friend to WF, and WF was a friend to him, yet now the hyenas pounce, and the vultures gather, and those who called themselves his friends turn on him and gleefully savor his downfall.

The air of manic delight in the misfortune of another human being that has been repeatedly exhibited throughout this thread is quite frankly disgusting. What does that say about all of you? As you all judge McGrunin's character, what does that say about you as human beings?

 

[Hurr-Durr]

It's all just "Baseless Allegations" bros...:

Source: Today: Martin (Grunin) on StockTwits

Can't believe how stupid he thinks everyone (but him) is! How is it baseless that the nameservers of his trading forum and and the similar-but-fake (misspelled) domain name of a marketing company in the allegations are same? Why would facebook make up stuff? They are clearly not after the money.

He's still in denial I bet. Kinda ironic he developed an app called "Steal This!"

 

[productionhead]

Word, ya'll going in on Marty. He's a WF brother man, how ya'll doing him like that? I stay weepin.

 

[robbie222]

There's a big difference between exploiting affiliate schemes (cookie stuffing) and actually impersonating people to take out lines of credit in their name for six figures...

What are the possible scenarios for Martin? I imagine Facebook isn't interesting in settling out of court and they want to make an example out of him, so I could see them getting a very large judgement + lawyer fees (anyone venture to guess Facebook's hourly lawyer fees? $800-$1000 an hour?).

And you know you done fucked up when the best case scenario is a $500,000 dollar bankrupting judgement. If they pursue this criminally, he'll most likely end up doing a year or 2 in some minimum security federal prison camp, and worst of all, labeled a convicted felon.

 

[icestationzebra]

The air of manic delight in the misfortune of another human being that has been repeatedly exhibited throughout this thread is quite frankly disgusting. What does that say about all of you? As you all judge McGrunin's character, what does that say about you as human beings?

You're right. I absolutely love seeing assholes get what they deserve.

This isn't misfortune, this is justice.

What do I think that says about me? that I'm a good person that just wishes everyone else in the world would play by the rules and be a good person too.

If you can't get through life without being a shitter, fuck you.

 

[Veritas]

YES YES YES

 

[I_like_cock]

don't think i'm some internet warrior faggot. I would knock you out in real life. I'm like muhammad ali, I back my talk up 110%. You on the other hand are like this guy

 

[Veritas]

No one, I mean No One talks to I LIKE COCK like that.

 

[Clay More]

The air of manic delight in the misfortune of another human being that has been repeatedly exhibited throughout this thread is quite frankly disgusting. What does that say about all of you? As you all judge McGrunin's character, what does that say about you as human beings?

McGrunin? Was there an imposter? This changes everything.

 

[I_like_cock]

No one, I mean No One talks to I LIKE COCK like that.

 

[infoslob]

If they pursue this criminally, he'll most likely end up doing a year or 2 in some minimum security federal prison camp, and worst of all, labeled a convicted felon.

A year in the pen for crimes against Facebook. Gotdamn. But you know ... there might be a way out for Grunin.

He can request a trial by tennis.

Facebook must accept the challenge or drop the charges, it's an ancient law still on the books in New York.

 

[jstover77]

 

[zimok]

Well, for one thing they have Grunin's attempts to sell the accounts on forums. They have his thinksmodo IP; the FRB wire info; Grunin engaging in wire (email) and bank fraud (fake Imprezzo bank statements); and lastly, you're really fucking stupid.

Sorry, but the word 'evidence' seems completely lost on you.

A post on a forum doesn't constitute as evidence, a PM between him and FB exchange details of alleged accounts would begin to resemble evidence.

An IP doesn't prove beyond a shadow of doubt that he's sitting at that computer, if you want to brush up on your armchair lawyer skills, please read.

The FRB wire info? Does FB have access to his personal banking details? Did they follow a transaction from an illicit activity to a banking account tied to his name/SSN/purchase history? LE doesn't seem to be involved yet and FB doesn't have access to that data.

Wire fraud via e-mail? Just like the location of a phone doesn't prove the source of the caller, an e-mail doesn't prove the identity of the sender.

Bank fraud claims? Do they have a video of him walking into a bank and using false statements? Do they have evidence beyond reasonable doubt that HE copied them, via handwriting analysis + another form of evidence to prove he had access to those documents?

As for your claim that I'm stupid, well yeah, I'm just another monkey. I never claimed I was smart, just that I didn't know. Better to be able to prove something you came to realize than to parrot something you heard.