Female Affiliate Managers, etc...

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Sawya said:
And yes you could say I want a "debate". The point of the thread - to shed light, who is your audience? The industry have no reason to listen since you are throwing stones from a glass house. The skittles thread and all of the t+a threads that get posted, great for the self esteem of the female members here I bet. If you care about the principle why allow these threads? If the reason is free speech then the industry could claim the exact same reason (if not free speech then freedom of association, or whatever freedom is appropriate to the situation) and so the first post is just a lament. Fair enough. But the fact you allow these threads while pretending to care so much about the princple just makes you a hypocrite.
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There is a difference between threads posting pics of girls who as a profession get naked for the camera and the harassment of people you work with.

Allowing those threads does not make Jon a hypocrite. Not allowing them would make him the hypocrite since he goes through a lot to make this forum a great place for freedom of speech and allows users to post pretty much anything.

If Jon believes in freedom of speech on here as well as believing that woman shouldn't have to get harassed by people they work with he shouldn't be called a hypocrite when they collide. Besides, last I checked the Skittles thread was started by me, not Jon.
 


How many of the skittles pictures were professional? Actually how many of them were even legal? Is there any reason to be arguing about whether these pictures degrade women? turbolapp has already said so in her opinion and I think any rational person would say the same. On par with harrasment - no, but still degrading.

The point is

Does the OP care about that degredation on this forum, at least moreso then free speech, the answer is obviously no otherwise it would have been moderated.

So the OP cares about free speech. Right, then why not extend the same courtesy to others in the industry? When you defend free speech you inevitably end up defending scoundrels, as the man said. I agree it's fine to support free speech and be against sexism and harrasment etc etc. but in that case all you can do is lament, and as I said, that is totally fair enough.

But then the law suit. This is saying "do as I say with your business, while leave me alone with mine". Anyway this is why I said about why should the industry listen or even be concerned. Their lawyers would have a field day with this site.
 
This is Sarah Palin inspired...right?? Seriously though....thanks for the shout out to women in the industry. The only AM that has given a crap about me is the only female AM I have....and no...she has not hit on me. If a guy is hitting on their AM manager, then he needs to just pay for a date 'cuz that is just weird and creepy. The only way to clean up the industry is to look in the mirror and analyze what WF can do....Jon...your post is a good start!
 
i'd do her! sarah palin that is. not any of my affiliate managers b/c that would be wrong.
 
This sort of shit can work in the favour of women - I know a fair few smart, attractive women who are fully aware of the effect they have on men, and use it to their best advantage. However they're all ballsy enough that if a man oversteps the line, they will tell him to go fuck himself.

That said, I agree that objectification of women is demeaning to both the women in question, and the men who partake in it. I used to work in the IT Networking industry, and I got sick of going to trade shows because of all the t&a on display there.... it's sending out the message that women aren't good enough to work in the industry as anything other than eye candy, and that men are too stupid to be attracted to anything other than a flash of skin.
 
Sawya said:
How many of the skittles pictures were professional? Actually how many of them were even legal? Is there any reason to be arguing about whether these pictures degrade women? turbolapp has already said so in her opinion and I think any rational person would say the same. On par with harrasment - no, but still degrading.

The point is

Does the OP care about that degredation on this forum, at least moreso then free speech, the answer is obviously no otherwise it would have been moderated.

So the OP cares about free speech. Right, then why not extend the same courtesy to others in the industry? When you defend free speech you inevitably end up defending scoundrels, as the man said. I agree it's fine to support free speech and be against sexism and harrasment etc etc. but in that case all you can do is lament, and as I said, that is totally fair enough.

But then the law suit. This is saying "do as I say with your business, while leave me alone with mine". Anyway this is why I said about why should the industry listen or even be concerned. Their lawyers would have a field day with this site.
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Skittles are dumb, AM's are smart :D





I guess!?
 
There's that one hottie aff manager chick who wears a "i heart nerds" necklace...seems to be playing in to the whole thing, imo.
 
Jon - maybe you should think about cleaning up your own forum first. Seems to me that you have a boobs icon for threads and advocate the requirement for naked women in such threads.

Probably not the nicest environment for female AMs to come to and see.
 
You are right Jon this is a problem. And unfortunately filling the Aff programs with chicks and maybe a bit on the hot side helps make the problem worse.

Add the lack of business sense that many in the AM field...

Plus a little alcohol or freedom of a conference and you have a recipe for disaster.

I have not seen it firsthand too much as I almost never go to conferences and the main private program aff manager I have is a big fat ugly old dude. He is lucky his wife flirts with him.
 
I agree with Jon. Ladies in this industry tend to be treated like objects rather then people. I've never been to affiliate summit but I plan to be at the vegas one. I would never ever think to sexually harass a female AM. Just because an AM is female it doesn't make her subservient to you or deserve less respect then a male affiliate.

If one of these femal AM's was my wife and I heard one of her business associates were sexually harassing her I'd be out for blood.
 
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narsticle said:
I agree with Jon. Ladies in this industry tend to be treated like objects rather then people. I've never been to affiliate summit but I plan to be at the vegas one. I would never ever think to sexually harass a female AM. Just because an AM is female it doesn't make her subservient to you or deserve less respect then a male affiliate.

If one of these femal AM's was my wife and I heard one of her business associates were sexually harassing her I'd be out for blood.
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My thoughts exactly. I used to take my wife with me to trade shows and after a while, I saw a pattern where the old fucks in the industry would always flock to her and shoot the shit and their wives would be asking me the important questions.

At the end of the day, any sexual harassment that continues to go on is the direct responsibility of the AM and her network. If I IM her and ask for a tit shot, it's her responsibility to escalate the issue to her boss. The boss should then correct the affiliate and/or drop his ass from the network. Sexual Harassment is really an easy issue compared to other HR issues. Either you actively and permanently stop the harassment or you get sued by the victim (male or female). Any employer that tolerates this shit deserves the lawsuit they get slapped with when the victim finally cracks.

Oh, and fuck you to the guys hitting on network employees via IM. You're creative to sell some bullshit weight loss pill to an anonymous web user but you're not creative enough to find a girl who likes you locally?
 
turbolapp said:
I don't know if hypocritical is the right word. But yes, it's odd to to have wf, which is known for it's tits and ass threads, pedo thread, and on going degradation of women threads to then have the owner get pissed about the harassment of women. I can see why people would be confused. It's a thin line.
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Yes, I have to say that as a female I hang out on WF "in spite" of the general tone of the place, and not because of it.

Flat out...not other WM forum that I have found has as much: real information, lack of spam, opportunity to network, and quality service providers. The other stuff is sort of embarassing, but I try to ignore it. I am too old to worry about fitting in.

In a perfect world, we would have WF without all of the sexist, macho crap. IMO ...it's sort of like the prayer in school thing... people should take care of that on their own time.
 
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