CX Digital... Massive Fraud?
- Thread starter erifdekciw
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Hmm.. that is weird, but I am guessing its the advertiser that does that because I do have several campaigns running with CX (IncentaClick) and they are doing great (some even peaked at 35% conversion rates so who knwos... I say take it up with your AM and see if he can give you an answer to this issue..
I had an identical experience with the same offer. While I do like CX for how they've treated me customer service wise, this type of stuff is unacceptable.
Same offer, same landing page, same directtrack, same merchant, same time of day, same traffic source, but a fraction of the conversions?
They did end up "investigating" and told me that there was, indeed, a tracking issue and I was given bonus leads, and that they would comp me bonus leads every day to make up for it, however, they did not include my subid data which makes tracking my campaigns worthless, and suggests to me (as i later discovered was true) that they were just comping me leads to keep me happy and on the network. I don't want special treatment, I want my shit to track properly. There were other affiliates I spoke with who had not been told about ANY tracking issue with the offer, and even when they asked their AM about it, the AM said they had no idea about any tracking issue either, which is a fairly blatant red flag as well.
At the end of the day, there are only 2 possible explanations for the discrepancy:
1) cx is shaving leads
2) the merchant is shaving all leads coming from cx
Anyway, like I said, theyve been great to me customer service wise, but stuff like this kinda makes them look bad. This and things like their internal search team outbidding their affiliates and then feeding their landing pages and campaign data to gooberaffiliate but denying said luxuries to other affiiliates =P (Extreme Acai Berry Extreme Acai Berry)
Same offer, same landing page, same directtrack, same merchant, same time of day, same traffic source, but a fraction of the conversions?
They did end up "investigating" and told me that there was, indeed, a tracking issue and I was given bonus leads, and that they would comp me bonus leads every day to make up for it, however, they did not include my subid data which makes tracking my campaigns worthless, and suggests to me (as i later discovered was true) that they were just comping me leads to keep me happy and on the network. I don't want special treatment, I want my shit to track properly. There were other affiliates I spoke with who had not been told about ANY tracking issue with the offer, and even when they asked their AM about it, the AM said they had no idea about any tracking issue either, which is a fairly blatant red flag as well.
At the end of the day, there are only 2 possible explanations for the discrepancy:
1) cx is shaving leads
2) the merchant is shaving all leads coming from cx
Anyway, like I said, theyve been great to me customer service wise, but stuff like this kinda makes them look bad. This and things like their internal search team outbidding their affiliates and then feeding their landing pages and campaign data to gooberaffiliate but denying said luxuries to other affiiliates =P (Extreme Acai Berry Extreme Acai Berry)
As with most things split test your traffic between networks as well as offers. Also be aware that they may not shave you in the beginning. But as time goes on the lead stealer dial gets turned more to the right. Just split test is all I can say. There's not reason that running the same offer on two networks one network should be 30% less. It's the same advertiser, same pixel fire, same everything the only difference is what's going on with the network itself. And possibly it's relations with the advertiser.
If you look at things most of you don't know what the advertiser is paying top dollar on this offer. At the price that CX is offering it at they must be scrubbing or they're losing money when you factor in AM salary, referral %, AM commission, Building, Phones, upper management salaries. That's a lot of overhead when you really do the math, so something has to budge some where.
If you haven't read it: My Prespective as an Affiliate, Advertiser and Network Owner on Scrubbing and Shaving | Affiliate, SEO and PHP Coding Blog - OOOFF.com
If you look at things most of you don't know what the advertiser is paying top dollar on this offer. At the price that CX is offering it at they must be scrubbing or they're losing money when you factor in AM salary, referral %, AM commission, Building, Phones, upper management salaries. That's a lot of overhead when you really do the math, so something has to budge some where.
If you haven't read it: My Prespective as an Affiliate, Advertiser and Network Owner on Scrubbing and Shaving | Affiliate, SEO and PHP Coding Blog - OOOFF.com
Unfortunately AM's are kept in the dark on anything like this as most are just sale people. And telling them what is really going on would just hamper their ability to sell. As far as your conversions split test between networks over a good amount of time xxmwxx as you may be leaving money on the table.
I will point out. This is shaving. Not scrubbing. These are sales, not leads.
There's a difference.
Yeah, I actually did split test and had better conversions with CX..
But again this is only for a certain offer...
Regarding the offer the creator of the thread is talking about.. I too run it with eAdvertising.. But he should talk to his AM to check for those days when he ran it using CX as they might "find leads" that "didn't register" and that'll help him reduce his losses.
uughh i hate hearing this kind of stuff because its everything thats wrong with this industry. If you are paying $1 lead, thats it no scrubbing should be allowed.
Regardless here is a story of CX's stupidity.
I was giving them very little traffic, just getting a feel for the network. Over a few months I was getting $100-$200 checks, nothing big at all. I was considering bringing over around $8,000 per month revenue to their network. My AM sucked the whole time. He was unknowledgable and very slow to respond to inquiries etc. I didnt get one of the biweekly checks for a whopping $58. Took me over a month to fight with my AM and actually get him to take care of a $58 problem.
Yes, CX digital did make good on the check and I got the small amount of money EVENTUALLY, but because of this stupidity, I took this $8,000/month campaign elsewhere.
Regardless here is a story of CX's stupidity.
I was giving them very little traffic, just getting a feel for the network. Over a few months I was getting $100-$200 checks, nothing big at all. I was considering bringing over around $8,000 per month revenue to their network. My AM sucked the whole time. He was unknowledgable and very slow to respond to inquiries etc. I didnt get one of the biweekly checks for a whopping $58. Took me over a month to fight with my AM and actually get him to take care of a $58 problem.
Yes, CX digital did make good on the check and I got the small amount of money EVENTUALLY, but because of this stupidity, I took this $8,000/month campaign elsewhere.
Yes they actually called me 5 minutes ago asking me that i should tell them first before i go posting problems. LOL well from the PM's im getting and the rants in here, im sure i wasn't the first person with this problem. So they can kiss my ass for all i care.
And they also were telling me the same BS. "oh somethings must of been wrong" etc etc. there utter crap to me now.
oh and this isn't a biased post to make you go join up at EAdvertising, I give credit where credit is due. Eadvertising saved my ass from a problem that was never mine to begin with!
It def was not fraud. I am no longer day to day with the company that it happened with (I serve on the board and in an advisory role) but I was the one that brought the deal to my team based on a pre-existing relationship I had with two members of the eAdvertising team. But I have not allowed either of my new companies to work with eAdvertising b/c I assumed the same people were in leading the team there. It boils down to Evan and Wendy just fucked this one up. At minimum I would have expected a call when they learned the payment was not going to be made and at least some sort of comp plan. I was the only one that lost anything out of that deal - money wise anyway. I have run an affiliate network before and although our t+c clearly stated we would only pay once an advertiser pays (as most do) I never once did not pay an affiliate. It is just bad business....plain and simple.
Volume10,
I agree with the comments about it being bad business practice. PM/IM anyway. I am still interested in hearing about the campaign and situation. As for Evan and Wendy, say no more. Mess up's happen, but how you handle it is what really matters.
I agree with the comments about it being bad business practice. PM/IM anyway. I am still interested in hearing about the campaign and situation. As for Evan and Wendy, say no more. Mess up's happen, but how you handle it is what really matters.
Response from CX Digital
Hello,
My Name is Tal Hayek. I am the VP, Affiliate Relations at CX Digital Media.
I just want to let everyone know that we are having our tech team look into this issue and will come out with a response soon.
I also would like to let everyone know that CX Digital is one of the best networks around. We are working with thousands of affiliates that are extremely happy with us. We are a public company which means that our standards are higher than almost all other networks out there.
I am concerned about this issue but would like to emphasize that much of the information needed to make a proper comparison is missing here.
I have also seen in the past that there are sometimes hidden agendas with these kinds of posts.
I would be more than happy to personally talk to any affiliates about this or any other issues.
Hello,
My Name is Tal Hayek. I am the VP, Affiliate Relations at CX Digital Media.
I just want to let everyone know that we are having our tech team look into this issue and will come out with a response soon.
I also would like to let everyone know that CX Digital is one of the best networks around. We are working with thousands of affiliates that are extremely happy with us. We are a public company which means that our standards are higher than almost all other networks out there.
I am concerned about this issue but would like to emphasize that much of the information needed to make a proper comparison is missing here.
I have also seen in the past that there are sometimes hidden agendas with these kinds of posts.
I would be more than happy to personally talk to any affiliates about this or any other issues.
Don't try and blame it on someone else or something else when obviously there are more victims here than just me who had the same problems and or currently are having the same problems.
Why don't you be the company you proclaim you are and fess up and take blame for something on your part. Or are you afraid of letting something out of the bag?
heh ya, nice fonts.
this thread is going to hurt. i wish aff networks would just not be greedy, take their percentage of the sale, and track accordingly...in a perfect world. Your already making money just simply being a middle man, and then to steal more is just garbage. Soon, someone will figure out that everything comes down to tracking and honesty....that company....will rise above everyone else. Oh wait, then there is still our friend the merchant...
this thread is going to hurt. i wish aff networks would just not be greedy, take their percentage of the sale, and track accordingly...in a perfect world. Your already making money just simply being a middle man, and then to steal more is just garbage. Soon, someone will figure out that everything comes down to tracking and honesty....that company....will rise above everyone else. Oh wait, then there is still our friend the merchant...
don't for an instant discount the merchant simply shaving a ton of leads to CX based on any number of factors (previous performance blah blah blah).
I've been on that end of the spectrum- literally had rotational tools in place to not fire every 5'th pixel. Not at all something I'm onboard with, but totally happens. Which is why when initially testing an offer it doesn't matter what your relationship with the network is, they may be 100% not trying to screw you- TEST THE OFFER AT MULTIPLE NETWORKS- find out if conversions are staggeringly varied.
I've seen conversion rates 150% off from this alone- in situations where I implicitly trust both networks/reps and have known them for years.
I've been on that end of the spectrum- literally had rotational tools in place to not fire every 5'th pixel. Not at all something I'm onboard with, but totally happens. Which is why when initially testing an offer it doesn't matter what your relationship with the network is, they may be 100% not trying to screw you- TEST THE OFFER AT MULTIPLE NETWORKS- find out if conversions are staggeringly varied.
I've seen conversion rates 150% off from this alone- in situations where I implicitly trust both networks/reps and have known them for years.
CXDTAL, 2 points I'd like to make.
1. Being a public company doesn't necessarily hold you to a higher standard. I.E. Enron anyone?
2. I know for a fact there was 2 affiliates both were running a good volume of traffic to you. One called you out on shaving after split testing and you credited him leads due to a "tracking problem". The other one never heard anything from you. If there was a "tracking problem" don't you think you should have alerted all affiliates that there was an issue? This was last Tuesday when I first heard about this "tracking issue".
We'd appreciate a response.
We as affiliates really want to be treated fairly and honestly so I think communication is the key. Anytime there is an issue with an offer I think affiliates running the offer would appreciate a an email letting them know there is something wrong.
Stop and put yourself in the shoes of a guy spending $1k a day to make you and them money. And there is a tracking issue going on, which the company knows about, and you're blowing your cash to promote it. How would you feel about them not telling you?
1. Being a public company doesn't necessarily hold you to a higher standard. I.E. Enron anyone?
2. I know for a fact there was 2 affiliates both were running a good volume of traffic to you. One called you out on shaving after split testing and you credited him leads due to a "tracking problem". The other one never heard anything from you. If there was a "tracking problem" don't you think you should have alerted all affiliates that there was an issue? This was last Tuesday when I first heard about this "tracking issue".
We'd appreciate a response.
We as affiliates really want to be treated fairly and honestly so I think communication is the key. Anytime there is an issue with an offer I think affiliates running the offer would appreciate a an email letting them know there is something wrong.
Stop and put yourself in the shoes of a guy spending $1k a day to make you and them money. And there is a tracking issue going on, which the company knows about, and you're blowing your cash to promote it. How would you feel about them not telling you?
Sometimes...
Ya gotta let 'em know, people.
And to think I sang their praises just six months ago.
I am shocked.
Not really, but I'm not using these guys anymore.
CXDigital - WTF!?
Ya gotta let 'em know, people.
And to think I sang their praises just six months ago.
I am shocked.
Not really, but I'm not using these guys anymore.
CXDigital - WTF!?
I was planning on moving my newest campaign over to CXdigital because 95% of my competitors in the niche are using CX don't think I will now, maybe I'll split test it.
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