My Conversation with Mark Karpeles of MtGox
- Thread starter Jon
- Start date
The inhumanity!
I bet they'd go straight to MtGox and serve them a C&D!
Why are you still mocking the possibility of the govt banning bitcoin? You still laugh as if it's impossible. China seems to have done a pretty good job of it though.
As you are mocking gov. power, by extent you mean they are powerless and weak.
If so, why not then trying to get into a government and make a real difference, as obviously your footprint would be more than writing on wickedfire, i assume.
Can you please explain your logic as this weak power government thing and your action doesn't add up for me.
Cheers
That's my point. China and India together have basically restricted 37.6% of the world's population from easily using bitcoin. Yet, you will mock their power as if it's a joke or something. That makes zero sense at all.
The problem with Luke is that he thinks people will use BTC although it's banned / declared illegal or blocked in any kind of way by a government. That might be right for us sneaky affiliate marketers or the underground selling shit you can't sell in public. But if that's what BTC is going to be at in future, it's far from mainstream.
Average joe does not trust an underground currency. Same as he does not trust a 'currency' where 100s of millions been stolen, that's completely unregulated and based on a couple of numbers.
But hey, it's still cheap coins... same as it was at $1k+, just a small temporary down, cause we all learned BTC isn't volatile at all and immune to governments and bad news.
Average joe does not trust an underground currency. Same as he does not trust a 'currency' where 100s of millions been stolen, that's completely unregulated and based on a couple of numbers.
But hey, it's still cheap coins... same as it was at $1k+, just a small temporary down, cause we all learned BTC isn't volatile at all and immune to governments and bad news.
Are you using a homegrown app?
something like this: http://www.wickedfire.com/shooting-shit/177121-i-made-bitcoin-bot.html
or something public like cryptotrader.org?
Against bittorrent, bitcoin, and other open source, decentralized apps? Yes. That's exactly what I think.
Ah, the old 'change the system from the inside' ploy.
Sorry, I'm not retarded. I'll stick to disruptive technologies, thanks... The only method that has ever shown any results.
Ever hear of bittorrent? Govs around the world have been trying to kill that since we called it napster. Turns out none of them can do anything anymore put have ISPs rat you out for downloading, if you're stupid enough to not use a VPN or TOR.
Bitcoin is orders of magnitude stronger than bittorrent at what makes bittorrent so censorship resistant.
And more useful, too.
The hell they have. They've restricted those people's local banks from touching it... As if banks wanted to in the first place! This is a far smaller threat to bitcoin than these govs think it is...
The entire point of bitcoin is to remove banks in the first place... It's 100% self-sufficent without being converted to any other currencies, so squeezing the conversion points, the only tool govs have against it, simply slows down adoption for the people who were already using banks. (Which is a far, far, far smaller number in those countries than 100% of their populations. More like 5%, in fact.)
I don't mock guns pointed at me. I mock them pointed at mathematics.
Luckily, there are literally MILLIONS of people, some in every country of the world, who hold bitcoin. You can't point guns at us all, and the numbers are growing rapidly.
Then there's the whole deniability thing. Most bitcoin holders won't reveal themselves to the govs, so the govs won't know who to point a gun at in the first place. Multiple people on Wickedfire already have brainwallets... Their offspring will never know monetary controls again from now forwards, despite all of mankind being under strict monetary control since before the time of Christ.
Wherever they go, forever, they can take as much value with them as they wish, and there's nothing anyone can do to stop this short of killing them or closing all borders... Neither of which is very conducive to a nonviolent citizenry.
First of all, if they declare it illegal in a country like the US, that would be a kind of victory too, because they'd be admitting it's so powerful that they can't compete with it. No country has done this; they've only discouraged exchanges and banned Banks from touching it.
Secondly, take what I said to Matt above out to its' logical conclusion here. If govs don't get aggressive against bitcoin, then as more useful apps come out, there is nothing to stop it's adoption. But if govs DO get aggressive against it, then the shy will slink away while the people who feel it's unfair for governments to take this wealth away from them will double down.
Remember, it's not really bitcoin itself they'd be supressing. There are tons of young industries now that you can only access with bitcoin. The entire Porn industry is now all using bitcoin, so it's only a matter of time before those millions of people all realize that they like the privacy of using btc for that purpose and raise their standards to only use bitcoin.
If the big, bumbling gov (in your country) comes along and says "bitcoinz iz illegul" then people suddenly cannot access the things they enjoy as easily and have immediately lost a portion of their savings in bitcoin.
Do you think people will like that or dislike that? Wouldn't they ask why the gov, who is supposed to be protecting them, just wants to take away their ability to do things that they enjoy and reduce their savings?
See: 21st Amendment for more details.
Average joe, if he exists, will learn after then next 1,000 useful apps and new industries that all only accept bitcoin come out, that bitcoin is necessary for the things he wants.
The 'one' killer app may still be a year or three off, but there are THOUSANDS of 'good enough apps' to get people from all walks of life and varied interests familliar with using bitcoin.
Even still, I'm starting to hear some really awesome rumors of an area of development that is likely to become the "killer app" that bitcoin needs to break out into the mainstream. It won't be too soon before it's ready, maybe not even this year, but I see all the pieces exist and lots of smart people are working in that direction now.
Before that happens though, the gap will be bridged by the man institutional investment banks throwing 50+ Million into bitcoin each. The first two, SecondMarket's BIT fund and the Winklevii's bitcoin fund already have 100k bitcoins in them now each and are on track to become official institutional, fully-tradable funds this year.
Behind that are 10+ wall street fund managers wanting to throw a minimum of $50M each at bitcoin-based funds, and these low prices lately are making them stir crazy... Their tweets are quite entertaining already... So that's about $600 Million in bitcoin on wall street. I think that might have a nice effect on the price for those of you who are so obsessed over it... But more importantly, it's going to make Mr. Joe Average far more familliar with bitcoin and adopting it properly sooner or later.
I am using CryptoTrader (using CoffeeScript) in tandem with a python script of my own that uses a modified auto-regressive time-series model along with some popular indicators like EMAs and fiat currency exchange rates for LTC and BTC. For now the bot trades solely between BTC/LTC. You could probably do it all in CoffeeScript, but I had trouble getting some of the math working properly so I run the python script for up-to-date models. There is also a large element of human intervention on my part when I see problem periods, so it isn't all automated. It's not perfect and I have had some rough days, but overall it is highly profitable and the past few days have been great fun. If the bot was free to just run wild for days on end I would be broke though, it's not point, click, make money.
PM me if you want more details.
thanks. i got a sense from their pseudo-board that there is a good amount of hand holding needed. also there seem to be issues with trade execution via their bots. the backtest feature is excellent -- but backtesting is one thing and the present (reality) is completely different
I just sent you a message, but it isn't showing up in my sent folder for some reason. Let me know if you don't get it. I have seen issues with trades being executed at times, but for the most part it works. I personally never run my bot when I can't monitor closely. Bitcoin is too wildly volatile.
Amazon says no to Bitcoin
And here we go...
Amazon Says No to Accepting Bitcoin, Maybe to Building an Amex or Visa Competitor | Re/code
Amazon Says No to Accepting Bitcoin, Maybe to Building an Amex or Visa Competitor
“Obviously it gets a lot of press and we have considered it,” Amazon payments head Tom Taylor told Re/code in a recent interview, “but we’re not hearing from customers that it’s right for them and don’t have any plans within Amazon to engage bitcoin.”
I mentioned to Taylor that many industry execs expect Amazon to eventually build its own full-blown payments network to compete against the big credit card companies. Will we see a day when the Amazon logo appears at a checkout counter alongside American Express, Visa and MasterCard?
So in two weeks China says no to Bitcoin / Number one retailer on earth says no, Warren Buffet says no ... what's next ?
Also after all seems like Credit Card company are not so evil....
The talk of bitcoin also led us to a discussion about credit card companies and the limited data they see about each transaction and how that prevents them from helping merchants deeply understand their customers’ shopping behavior.
And here we go...
Amazon Says No to Accepting Bitcoin, Maybe to Building an Amex or Visa Competitor | Re/code
Amazon Says No to Accepting Bitcoin, Maybe to Building an Amex or Visa Competitor
“Obviously it gets a lot of press and we have considered it,” Amazon payments head Tom Taylor told Re/code in a recent interview, “but we’re not hearing from customers that it’s right for them and don’t have any plans within Amazon to engage bitcoin.”
I mentioned to Taylor that many industry execs expect Amazon to eventually build its own full-blown payments network to compete against the big credit card companies. Will we see a day when the Amazon logo appears at a checkout counter alongside American Express, Visa and MasterCard?
So in two weeks China says no to Bitcoin / Number one retailer on earth says no, Warren Buffet says no ... what's next ?
Also after all seems like Credit Card company are not so evil....
The talk of bitcoin also led us to a discussion about credit card companies and the limited data they see about each transaction and how that prevents them from helping merchants deeply understand their customers’ shopping behavior.
While you're waiting around, I just realized a $140 per bitcoin gain since our conversation began.
Here's a prime reason of why Bitcoin pisses me off:
https://www.sq1.tv/bitcoin
Just watch the first 5 - 10 mins or so. The guys talking are the leaders of bitcoin, and just look at how far they have their heads up their asses. They remind me of lukep. They just can't shut up about how "amazing" the technology is, that any & all fundamental flaws that get pointed out go right over their heads, while they continue on their tirade about how amazing bitcoin is.
Then they wonder why it hasn't really progressed worth shit, and why interest from VC and major corps is now waning, and why govts are now cracking down on it. That type of mindset is the worst possible mindset you can have when developing a new technology. Always assuming you're the underdog, you're behind the pack, there's tons more you can do to improve, etc. Not these guys though -- they just preach about how amazing it is.
https://www.sq1.tv/bitcoin
Just watch the first 5 - 10 mins or so. The guys talking are the leaders of bitcoin, and just look at how far they have their heads up their asses. They remind me of lukep. They just can't shut up about how "amazing" the technology is, that any & all fundamental flaws that get pointed out go right over their heads, while they continue on their tirade about how amazing bitcoin is.
Then they wonder why it hasn't really progressed worth shit, and why interest from VC and major corps is now waning, and why govts are now cracking down on it. That type of mindset is the worst possible mindset you can have when developing a new technology. Always assuming you're the underdog, you're behind the pack, there's tons more you can do to improve, etc. Not these guys though -- they just preach about how amazing it is.
The bitcoin foundation and its leaders are corrupt and will lead to the eventual collapse of bitcoin.
Nice work. Yup I realize BTC can gain or fall by a lot at any time. It doesn't mean Buffet's quote is applicable to BTC or even most assets - cause it's not.
Furfy bro, you really need to try and keep up with the news more... Amazon has their own 'coin' and I would be very suprised to see them destroy that to jump on the bitcoin bandwagon at this level of involvement.
The world doesn't revolve around you bro. I meant it when I said that the long list of bad news for bitcoin is eclipsed by the good news. Check out any site like Coindesk.com or bitcoinmagazine.com and see for yourself. Just because you aren't hearing the good news yourself doesn't mean the sky is falling.
Sounds quite evil to me... By your quote alone what else can be deduced than credit cards want to invade our privacy even more than they have been doing? Exactly the wrong tactic to take in a post-Snowden world.
So it pisses you off that some people see something amazing that you don't appreciate yourself? Fuck, how would anything ever get discovered or developed in your little Amish world?
Don't confuse them with yourself. You are nothing like them.
I see no evidence of that at all. Quite the contrary.
No one but morons who don't understand what bitcoin is are surprised by this at all. The underlying technology is at odds with the very existence of any centralization of power. Governments and bitcoin will never, ever exist in harmony, period.
The reason I can't shut up about it is because this is the first thing in all of human history that governments also can't destroy. They can slow down things by closing exchanges and pushing businesses off their individual shores, but the coin will continue to grow because it's just too damn useful, period.
They aren't the developers. They'd be politicians if they could; I have no respect for the foundation, and neither do any core developers.
We just don't speak out about them because they do a good job of legitimizing the coin to the rest of the world, which buys us time to grow, nothing more.
You give them way too much credit bro. They can't collapse bitcoin anymore than a government can shoot bitcoin. I'm glad they're there taking the flack from governments now... As misguided as they are, they are helping adoption more than anything else in the US at least... For now.
What I mean when I say collapse, is that they will push for regulation, and change crypto-currency as we know it
Actually I think they can mess up BTC but only if people running bitcoin-qt(miners) accept their changes. Miners are the ones controlling what version of the bitcoin software is accepted.. so the question is why wouldn't they eventually go corrupt (like every one else) and make a version of BTC that gives them more BTC/rewards for mining?