Google is fucked

Organic traffic cannot be cheaper than paid traffic... that is ultimately what google is doing.

People can still rank for low comp kw's and even medium comp kw's, but this will not last very long.

If you're ranking now it only means that there arent enough big sites (wikipedia, ask, wiki-how, etc...) with relevant content yet for that kw.

1st page organic listings will become a distant memory for the average webmaster in the near future (unless it's local).
 


This has turned into quite an interesting discussion. I want to clarify that my post was intended to make it clear, that traffic trading is difficult for a lot of niches because the volume just isn't there. Still i would agree with the notion, that people should look into other venues of traffic and i certainly applaud to these efforts and would participate in traffic exchanges. I remember that during the geocity days, EVERY site had these little "sitering" widgets installed and i clearly remember making quite exstensive use of them. It helped me find new, interesting sites. Nowadays, similiar concepts still exist. Look at stumbleupon...look at click exchanges which were VERY popular just a couple of years back. Both ideas are not perfect. Either not targeted enough or the traffic quality is pure shit.

I would welcome someone coming up with a context related traffic exchange script. In the meantime, one could experiment with adult traffic trading scripts. I mean, in the end, this might even make google not be such a bitch about rankings if they suffer traffic drops that is.

Don't misunderstand me, i'm all for more independence and emancipation from the Big G. I just believe that it'S a hard thing to do...and that is something you seem to agree with me on Michael.
 
kryaa said:
Don't misunderstand me, i'm all for more independence and emancipation from the Big G. I just believe that it'S a hard thing to do...and that is something you seem to agree with me on Michael.
Click to expand...

Plan and design your site without thinking about G. Plan your traffic independently from search engines.

I sometimes think that people miss the point about article marketing and think that it's solely for SERP position / SEO when there are stacks of sites that will generate traffic for you.
 
kryaa said:
Don't misunderstand me, i'm all for more independence and emancipation from the Big G. I just believe that it'S a hard thing to do...and that is something you seem to agree with me on Michael.
Click to expand...

I only think it's difficult because it's hard to start a movement by yourself. The technology is already 10-15 years old. It only takes one, impressive traffic trading script, designed for mainstream sites and a small group of medium-large sites to start a revolution. Ever since my first few websites, I was always, and remain to be, completely dumbfounded as to why mainstream sites don't make any effort to automate site-to-site trading or even use it at all. It really just makes absolutely no fucking sense whatsoever.

Do you know how many webmasters are out there who can't do SEO? If they knew there was an alternative, a way to automate trading with related sites, they would naturally go for the quicker, easier route. As it stands now, in many, many people eyes, Google is the only source of traffic, everything else is just a bonus.

And here's the other thing that gets me: It's not a matter of "either or" in this case; you don't trade traffic with related sites or get Google traffic. It was mentioned earlier in this thread how adult sites don't get much traffic from social media or search engines and still do fine. Imagine if mainstream sites, that do get this traffic in leaps and bounds, all started utilizing the traffic trading methods of adult sites. Google would shit itself.

Maybe it is just wishful thinking, and maybe it's not quite the right solution for mainstream sites, but doing anything to get traffic moving in-between webmasters seems like a must for the future.
 
Michael_ said:
I only think it's difficult because it's hard to start a movement by yourself. The technology is already 10-15 years old. It only takes one, impressive traffic trading script, designed for mainstream sites and a small group of medium-large sites to start a revolution. Ever since my first few websites, I was always, and remain to be, completely dumbfounded as to why mainstream sites don't make any effort to automate site-to-site trading or even use it at all. It really just makes absolutely no fucking sense whatsoever.

Do you know how many webmasters are out there who can't do SEO? If they knew there was an alternative, a way to automate trading with related sites, they would naturally go for the quicker, easier route. As it stands now, in many, many people eyes, Google is the only source of traffic, everything else is just a bonus.

And here's the other thing that gets me: It's not a matter of "either or" in this case; you don't trade traffic with related sites or get Google traffic. It was mentioned earlier in this thread how adult sites don't get much traffic from social media or search engines and still do fine. Imagine if mainstream sites, that do get this traffic in leaps and bounds, all started utilizing the traffic trading methods of adult sites. Google would shit itself.

Maybe it is just wishful thinking, and maybe it's not quite the right solution for mainstream sites, but doing anything to get traffic moving in-between webmasters seems like a must for the future.
Click to expand...

I don't think it's necessarily a good comparison comparing people clicking on yet another thumbnail of some porn movie to see more porn (trading traffic that way), to how visitors behave in non-adult circumstances.

For example, would the New york times add a similar articles link reel to the bottom of their pages that links to the UK telegraph? Maybe, but would people click on it as much as "yet another porn thumbnail"? I don't think so.

Or how likely would someone be to click on a link in an article and then buy something when before they were in just research mode? Not that likely, google has an edge there as they can capture the moment of buying intent. Traffic swapping can never be as profitable as that.

There are probably cases where it would work well, but I think the way people browse porn and the fact that it's mostly similar stuff makes traffic sharing much easier.
 
I'm sure I'm just being nostalgic at this point, but that's one thing I liked about non-mainstream sites, there were no rules. You were only limited by whatever you could come up with.

People didn't just make content sites as entryways to their sales funnels, the content sites themselves were funnels. You designed your sites to be black holes.

If a guy was moving through your pages, gobbling up all your content and not clicking your money-making ads, you could artfully increase the amount of outbound links, that, when clicked on, would register on someone elses script, telling them they needed to send you a visitor in return.

Dude hits his back button on the entry of your funnel? Pop-up to an exit traffic exchange.

Dude drifting deep into your content funnel without clicking your ads? Increase outbound links to trades the deeper you get into the funnel.

Dude still not clicking on your money ads, deep into the funnel? Pop-under traffic exchange.

The goal was to never let a visitor to be wasted. Once on your site, you made them serve you in some way. And, no matter how you did it, nobody could say shit - because it was your site and you made the rules.

dsm56 said:
There are probably cases where it would work well, but I think the way people browse porn and the fact that it's mostly similar stuff makes traffic sharing much easier.
Click to expand...

I don't disagree. Naturally, all the tactics that work in adult wouldn't translate well into mainstream, but doing anything is better than what mainstream sites are doing now, where, largely, their only source of traffic is Google.
 
kryaa said:
This has turned into quite an interesting discussion. I want to clarify that my post was intended to make it clear, that traffic trading is difficult for a lot of niches because the volume just isn't there. Still i would agree with the notion, that people should look into other venues of traffic and i certainly applaud to these efforts and would participate in traffic exchanges. I remember that during the geocity days, EVERY site had these little "sitering" widgets installed and i clearly remember making quite exstensive use of them. It helped me find new, interesting sites. Nowadays, similiar concepts still exist. Look at stumbleupon...look at click exchanges which were VERY popular just a couple of years back. Both ideas are not perfect. Either not targeted enough or the traffic quality is pure shit.

I would welcome someone coming up with a context related traffic exchange script. In the meantime, one could experiment with adult traffic trading scripts. I mean, in the end, this might even make google not be such a bitch about rankings if they suffer traffic drops that is.

Don't misunderstand me, i'm all for more independence and emancipation from the Big G. I just believe that it'S a hard thing to do...and that is something you seem to agree with me on Michael.
Click to expand...
Yes, this is a very interesting discussion, and I learned a lot about how the adult industry operates independently (mostly) from Google. I even bookmarked a couple of adult industry news sites for further insights into their business model. Now all I need is a porn name. :p

What other niches use interlinking networks besides adult and mom blogs? I've been working in the mom blog space for about 6 weeks with a site that I use for lead-gen and list-building. It works like butter.

The stats are very unusual. The more I participate and interlink, the higher the traffic gets. About 5% of the traffic comes from Google. Alexa rankings have moved from the millions to 130,000 or so in weeks because so many of the moms that visit use the Alexa toolbar to boost their rankings.

Even so, the moms worry about pleasing Google, and always ask that shared posts be no-index. Old habits are hard to break.
 
To be fair I would expect the average "mom blogger" to understand what no-follow and do-follow actually means, but nonetheless it highlights the fact that people follow Clutt's drivel without question.

Google will have their market chipped away and eroded. They have hit the point where they think they are the internet, and for many people that is the case, but it should be remembered that Google is only so big and the Internet will always be bigger by an order of magnitude.

Anyway - slightly off topic there, but this is becoming an interesting thread - move from STS pls?
 
microphone head said:
To be fair I would expect the average "mom blogger" to understand what no-follow and do-follow actually means, but nonetheless it highlights the fact that people follow Clutt's drivel without question.
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Even so, I cooperate and do as they ask. There are a few dad blog sites, but as a network run by women cooperation is paramount. Competition among the sites is almost non-existent, except for harmlessly trying to top each other's scores at Klout or Picket Fences. Mom blog communities are very anti-SEO, with everyone drawing strength from the community and social sharing.

microphone head said:
Google will have their market chipped away and eroded. They have hit the point where they think they are the internet, and for many people that is the case, but it should be remembered that Google is only so big and the Internet will always be bigger by an order of magnitude.
Click to expand...

It's inevitable that something will erode Google's importance. This constant churn keeps the Internet viable and dynamic.
 
emp said:
Outbrain would be one such script.

Outbrain

Are you guys just not doing your research?

::emp::
Click to expand...

I tried outbrain for one of my sites - I think I showed you it, I ended up dropping it. I got a total of 159 visits from them while sending out 5,739. It was a traffic leak in my scenario. I might tried them on another blog which has a little more stickiness. It's a good concept, but it might make sense to look into competitors.​
 
CCarter said:
I tried outbrain for one of my sites - I think I showed you it, I ended up dropping it. I got a total of 159 visits from them while sending out 5,739. It was a traffic leak in my scenario. I might tried them on another blog which has a little more stickiness. It's a good concept, but it might make sense to look into competitors.​
Click to expand...

I call this "last century thinking" - and it is precisely why most mainstream / established sites don't do this.

It is not a traffic leak. That visitor was most likely going away from your site anyway.

::emp::
 
emp said:
I call this "last century thinking" - and it is precisely why most mainstream / established sites don't do this.

It is not a traffic leak. That visitor was most likely going away from your site anyway.

::emp::
Click to expand...

That's one of the reasons I wanted to test it first. My pageviews dropped when I introduced Outbrain, and re-bounced when I removed it. In that scenario it was a traffic leak, but that doesn't mean every scenario will be the same. I'm setting up another test on another site that's more sticky and will see the results. Always test.​
 
This has been an interesting thread, and would like to read more insights from members.

I could contribute by writing a detailed how-to post on receiving free leads using mom blogs. Is there any interest in a post like this?
 
Paper_Chase said:
Yes, please do brah.
Click to expand...
I'll write a spinoff of this thread for the Traffic forum soon. I think it's a topic that deserves a separate thread.

BTW, I doubt many of you have the stomach to follow through with the stuff I'm doing. These are female mommy things. Maybe your female VAs could execute the plan.
 
Zaino said:
I dont even know what to say, google is really on another planet. Not only looking at it from my own little piss ant properties but the net as a whole, this is the way the ecosystem is.

It is clear that the previous video I posted a couple months ago indicating that anything that resembles a guest post be no followed, anything with author profiles should be no followed.

Author rank is a trap card.

Publishers & Webmasters Now Fear Linking Out At All
Click to expand...



I stopped giving a shit about google when they started talking about "thin affiliate sites" and such. They were a giant fucking scraper at the time. Then when they started whining about comparison sites advertising... and banning adwords advertisers because of it, whatthefuckever. By the time they started telling webmasters how to link, and making special tags they found acceptable, I was well past giving a shit what they thought.

For many years, their only product was scraping sites. Fuck them. Truth told, I make money from google in both organic search and PPC. But when they start whining about "spam," they're full of shit. They had a sucky algorithm, and complain that it's the fault of people they're scraping.

I probably posted at webmasterworld from 8-10 years ago, and eventually just stopped going there because I got tired of everyone sucking Matt Cutts, and acting like googleguy was their best friend.

The positive here is that I saw the writing on the wall, and started a business with a product. But really, fuck google, and fuck their black box ppc shit. I remember when I thought Overture was bullshit, and that was at least an honest auction.

Google also fucked me for a few k on useless mobile traffic recently. Oh... suddenly they can't differentiate mobile traffic, and it's to my advantage somehow. lol. whatever.
 
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