Google is fucked
- Thread starter Zaino
- Start date
mm... What percentage of website owners really know how nofollow works? Sure, if you want to make money from the Internet, you do, but if you are a photographer just showcasing your portfolio you can't care less.
G is out of their mind.
Trying to figure out what Google really wants (Hint: they don't even know what they fucking want) =
When webmasters going to wise up and just start trading traffic between each other using traffic scripts like adult sites have been doing since the 90s? There's tons of adult sites out there who don't rank for shit in Google that are getting millions of uniques per month.
Trade links/traffic between you and your competition. Get a flow of traffic coming in from multiple, related sites and let them do all the worrying over if Google is going to derank them because they farted in the wind while facing away from the sun on a Tuesday.
When webmasters going to wise up and just start trading traffic between each other using traffic scripts like adult sites have been doing since the 90s? There's tons of adult sites out there who don't rank for shit in Google that are getting millions of uniques per month.
Trade links/traffic between you and your competition. Get a flow of traffic coming in from multiple, related sites and let them do all the worrying over if Google is going to derank them because they farted in the wind while facing away from the sun on a Tuesday.
Well, in niches with massive traffic, people are doing this...think entertainment, think cat pictures and videos.
I'm not too sure it would work so great with niche sites about yellow doorhandles. It would have to be contextual....some kind of a traffic trade adsense.
Also, don't forget that traffic trading in adult works for a reason: People are UNSATISFIABLE when it comes to porn. They click and click and click until they find something cumworthy. These traffic trading scripts take advantage of that and just circle jerk traffic around ...but more traffic circulation does not equal more sales. It's more like they adapt to the fact that a typical porn user clicks around for ages before he jacks of...hopefully to something found on a 39,99$ membership site with 3 month in advance rebills.
On the traffic aspect, you're thinking in only terms of adult traffic.
What's to stop a mommy blogger from randomly injecting multiple, well-placed, non-bullshit, auto-updating, customized top list link lists throughout her site (like many adult sites do)?
One of the first things I learned when I started doing websites, back in the 90s, was that you don't want to have any traffic leaks on your pages. Every click should serve you in some way. If it wasn't going to make you money, it should be generating you traffic.
Mainstream sites don't seem to adhere to this rule because everyone is so busy trying to lick Google's asshole, that they are afraid to trade links with each other, thus solidifying Google's control of the majority of the web traffic.
Why do you think Google is hell bent on making people scared to link to and from their sites? They don't want webmasters trading traffic between each other, at all.
If you have a site about underwater basket weaving and Google is the only way you can reach the .00001% of the population that is interested in that, well, tough shit. You should have chosen a market with more mainstream appeal, that gets more than 100 searches a month.
Let me give you an example that is non-adult (I use adult because it works so well).
Let's say Google just decided to say "fuck off" to the entire payday loan industry and blacklisted any and every payday loan site from their listings. Do you really think that gigantic online industry is just going to fold because Google stopped listing them? No. They'll just start trading traffic between each other and leeching from other sites that are able to rank for related terms. Then, if one of their sources gets axed, who fucking cares? They just replace it with the next guy that is ranking in his place.
I want to add more to this because I haven't anything better to do at the moment. Granted, it's all conjecture because I've never been a big website baller (although there were times when I was handling over a million uniques a month on my adult ventures, way back in the day).
I can still recall the time before Google was a household name. There was never a shortage of websites out there and it was common practice for every niche to get and build traffic using link exchanges. Some were from directories, classifieds, link lists, and things like that. Pretty much all sites were generating and trading traffic using similar methods.
Then, at some point, Google starting rising to fame and anyone who could turn on a monitor could achieve a #1 ranking. What I saw happen was that mainstream sites, who had a harder time getting and maintaining traffic trades, simply started focusing on Google, while adult sites kept doing what they were doing and Google traffic was just a bonus.
Fast forward to today, and now arranging traffic exchanges between mainstream sites is an out-of-this-world concept. If someone's site isn't ranking in Google, for whatever reason, they just dump it and start a new one with the same goal - to rank in Google. Meanwhile, adult sites are still carrying on as usual, some getting Google rankings, but many not caring because they can get so much traffic from other sources and traffic trades.
Granted, yes, adult sites, by their very nature, do have an easier time in this department. But, people seeking information/solutions aren't that much different from people looking for their fapping fix. 9 times out of 10 people aren't going to find the information they're looking for on the first site they visit from Google (hello 1st page listings dominated by ask.com, wikihow.com, about.com, ask.yahoo.com, etc). So there is plenty of surfing and clicking going on.
Only recently am I starting to notice content traffic exchanges popping up for mainstream sites (10+ years after the adult industry had already perfected these types of traffic exchanges), via "related posts" traffic exchanges and things of that nature.
The problem with these exchanges, so far (aside from them not being as fraud-proof as their more experienced, adult counterparts) is that mainstream webmasters have grown so dependent on Google, that they are deathly afraid of linking to and from anything, for fear of what Google will do.
So everyone just sits around, dancing each and every month to Google's next outrageous ranking requirement, while Google continues to increase its stranglehold over mainstream traffic by telling webmasters who they can and can't link to/from. All the mainstream sites bow before the Google alter, saying, "Yes, Master, we'll fix it right away! Please, disavow all my links!" While the adult markets and similar niches give Google the middle finger and go about business as usual.
Anyway, that's all my rambling for today.
(O_o)
H̨̼̩͐̑͆̀̚&
Yes, yes, exactly!!
The problem was in the beginning Google was so easy to rank, everyone forgot/dropped the other methods, and then all of a sudden it's gotten more difficult, but now they can't recall the other methods of getting traffic. In the ancient world there was a time before Google...
The Adult industry online has been at the forefront of most new advances online. Pop ups - started with Adult. Interstitial Ads - adult, mobile websites - adult, Mass email marketing - adult. Mass mailing lists - adult. Affiliate marketing - adult. Streaming video - Porn beat youtube by 10 years. Search Engines - Porn had their own Adult search engines before Google was on the scene. They recognized the benefits of fresh daily new content - not for the sake of Google, but for the sake of the visitors coming back to the site! Directory listing - adult. Split testing online - adult. Most of the great ideas that make money can be found in the adult industry before it became "main stream". And I'm not talking about who was the first to do it, I'm talking about who was the first to massively profit off these techniques and is the reason it's now main stream.
Simple fact is, if you want to see what new techniques are happening that will eventually flow over to main stream internet marketing, look at what adult sites are doing. If you see some new trend in the adult industry, in 1-3 years, it'll be main stream with internet marketers. Adult is at the forefront of the "internet is serious money business".
Edit: One of the reasons they have to continue to innovate is because it's so competitive. The markets is beyond saturated, but still profitable for people that really think outside the box and can capitalize on their ideas.
The problem was in the beginning Google was so easy to rank, everyone forgot/dropped the other methods, and then all of a sudden it's gotten more difficult, but now they can't recall the other methods of getting traffic. In the ancient world there was a time before Google...
The Adult industry online has been at the forefront of most new advances online. Pop ups - started with Adult. Interstitial Ads - adult, mobile websites - adult, Mass email marketing - adult. Mass mailing lists - adult. Affiliate marketing - adult. Streaming video - Porn beat youtube by 10 years. Search Engines - Porn had their own Adult search engines before Google was on the scene. They recognized the benefits of fresh daily new content - not for the sake of Google, but for the sake of the visitors coming back to the site! Directory listing - adult. Split testing online - adult. Most of the great ideas that make money can be found in the adult industry before it became "main stream". And I'm not talking about who was the first to do it, I'm talking about who was the first to massively profit off these techniques and is the reason it's now main stream.
Simple fact is, if you want to see what new techniques are happening that will eventually flow over to main stream internet marketing, look at what adult sites are doing. If you see some new trend in the adult industry, in 1-3 years, it'll be main stream with internet marketers. Adult is at the forefront of the "internet is serious money business".
Edit: One of the reasons they have to continue to innovate is because it's so competitive. The markets is beyond saturated, but still profitable for people that really think outside the box and can capitalize on their ideas.
Grindstone is in charge of the department that decides what is or is not an editorial link. PM him before making that post or you may have a really bad week.
I wish you would ramble more, and often. You are 100% correct about everything you said. This is one of those rare threads that make WF the best marketing forum in the industry.
I don't know if it's that people have forgotten these methods, rather than it's difficult to trade traffic with yourself.
To continue on this discussion:
I mean, to the vast, vast majority of mainstream sites out there, automating site-to-site traffic trades is a revolutionary concept, if only because no one else is doing it; it certainly isn't a new concept, by any means.
You can take an adult site, build it, and get it to over 1000 uv/day in two weeks or less, even with very little experience (granted that traffic isn't worth as much as most mainstream traffic, but that's not the point). However, it's infinitely more difficult to do that with mainstream sites.
Why? Because site-to-site traffic trading is so common, streamlined and automated in the adult industry that there's an endless sea of sites to trade with. Where as in mainstream niches, it's largely unheard of. Google, Yahoo, and Bing could close up shop tomorrow and while mainstream online markets crash overnight, the adult industry would barely feel it (maybe that's an exaggeration, but maybe not).
With as fucking insane as Google has become over the last three, short years, you would think people would be falling all over themselves to mainstream site-to-site trading in order to stabilize and safeguard their traffic and incomes, but it seems Google is working feverishly to discourage against that (Hell, even interlinking your sites is a big, common red flag in the eyes of Google. What does that tell you?) - and people just appear to sit back and lap it up.
(O_o)
H̨̼̩͐̑͆̀̚&
Social signals is where adult hurts the most and always will. Dat social sigma.
Unless you are just that mega weird guy and go around sharing RedTube and PornHub links all day on FB to your family and friends lol.
Mainstream is so much easier to market and "acceptable". I got out of adult when the recession hit the industry hard. Adult SEO is pretty easy IMO, you just need to know a bunch of GFY/adult webmaters with big sites.
Unless you are just that mega weird guy and go around sharing RedTube and PornHub links all day on FB to your family and friends lol.
Mainstream is so much easier to market and "acceptable". I got out of adult when the recession hit the industry hard. Adult SEO is pretty easy IMO, you just need to know a bunch of GFY/adult webmaters with big sites.
Yep. I think that makes it even more impressive, though. Tons and tons of adult sites do just fine without much traffic from Google or Social Networks.
Going into adult wasn't the purpose of mentioning porn, but rather learning from their new techniques/innovations and then applying it to your own niche/industry if applicable. Due to the social stigma the adult industry has to innovated faster and better than their main stream counterparts. When you are in a scenario where the main roads are blocked off, you have to create your own roads for traffic.
I agree, the unfortunate dominant mentality is about getting rankings in Google rather than getting targeted traffic. Eventually if Google continues this route it will only force websites into a corner where they have to get traffic by other means. PPC is not the only answer. If this catches on, Google could, not likely, make itself irrelevant. Kinda of like how no one really cares about yahoo or bing traffic. Once you find another avenue, fuck that difficult shit.
If one did a mental exercise on how to get traffic if Google didn't exist, you could brainstorm some pretty creative ideas - the trick would be to get others involved or create a campaign that'll go viral itself.
A great example was that Eat24.com topic a few days back where they went were traffic was the cheapest, adult, and simply advertising their brand since hey, Porn watchers have to eat too right? (ADVERTISING ON PORN SITES WORKS, JUST ASK EAT24) They thought outside the box, and took a leap of faith and are being rewarded for it. It's unlikely people will start thinking of Porn with eat24.com now - so it's about experimenting. Also, it took them getting out of the conservative mindset and took a major risk and profited.
Now obviously it's not for everyone, but can an electronic eCommerce store selling monitors do that same thing? Probably, I would assume that's everyone on a website would be in the monitor buying niche at some point in their life - but it took a pioneer, eat24, to go out and risk it. That's what separates the 1%. "You Can Recognize A Pioneer By The Arrows In His Back" - but that pioneer is still ahead of the rest of the industry by leaps and bounds, now they others have to catch up to him.
If one did a mental exercise on how to get traffic if Google didn't exist, you could brainstorm some pretty creative ideas - the trick would be to get others involved or create a campaign that'll go viral itself.
A great example was that Eat24.com topic a few days back where they went were traffic was the cheapest, adult, and simply advertising their brand since hey, Porn watchers have to eat too right? (ADVERTISING ON PORN SITES WORKS, JUST ASK EAT24) They thought outside the box, and took a leap of faith and are being rewarded for it. It's unlikely people will start thinking of Porn with eat24.com now - so it's about experimenting. Also, it took them getting out of the conservative mindset and took a major risk and profited.
Now obviously it's not for everyone, but can an electronic eCommerce store selling monitors do that same thing? Probably, I would assume that's everyone on a website would be in the monitor buying niche at some point in their life - but it took a pioneer, eat24, to go out and risk it. That's what separates the 1%. "You Can Recognize A Pioneer By The Arrows In His Back" - but that pioneer is still ahead of the rest of the industry by leaps and bounds, now they others have to catch up to him.
But first, understand Google's desire for currency.
I think the problem with some SEOs is they view Google's behavior from a technical perspective. From a marketing POV, Google's modus operandi makes perfect sense.
They're in the business of selling clicks. If you're selling a product of any kind, it's in their best interest to bury your site on page 7, and serve up the About & Wiki pages on page one.
Now if you wanna be on page one, Google wants you to pay to be there. They make no money when people can find your site using SEO. And if Google says they're trying to serve up the best, most high quality results for customers, it's b.s. Google is not a public service search engine.
SEOs and Google will eternally struggle in algorithm combat. Framing Google's behavior in this way might make it easier to understand what they're doing and why they do it.