Arizona New Law

[willcosys]

There is so much irony in the shit you say.

People complain about the jobs issue. Now, what is IRONIC about that. The same REPUBLICAN DOUCHEBAGS pushing for these laws are the same ones that employ the "illegals". Nanny's, Yard workers, Gardeners, Picking in the fields.

Oh and lets address you as a capitalistic fucker shall we. If those same companies lose the "illegals" you hate so much. Who do you think will end up paying for it. I will give you a hint. Starts with Y middle letter is O and the last one is U.

These companies, will just pass the cost on to you. So either way you are getting fucked. I suppose which way is an order of preference.


On draining the economy. They help the economy as they keep the cost of shit down. They pay local tax everytime they go to the store and buy something. Not all illegals pay no taxes. Some own homes and pay property tax on them. Live with someone who does and helps them pay it.



The problem with the law in AZ isn't that it is trying to get "illegals" out of the state/country. It is basically racial profiling, who do you think are going to be targets of this thing. People that "look" like "illegals" to me that would be trampling on my liberties as an American.




Now, as far as the "illegals" and immigration reform. We need a better system in place to allow them to come here. Like someone stated having to wait 10+ years is just insane.

The reform needs to address more things then hunting them down and shipping them out. Though this will never happen here is what I think needs to be done.


1. Easier and more open borders. I better process to allow immigrants to come to our country.

2. A special working visa, That allows an employer to pay them like $1 less in minimum wage.

3. With this special visa - There would be an incentive and certain tax breaks for employers to hire them. Now I know OMG Affirmative Action but...

These lower wage people will help the economy grow. Put certain restrictions on the percentage a company is allowed. Say 5-10% of the employees are allowed at this special Visa.

Remember a lot of employers just simply go over the borders to do things anyway. Doing something like this would help keep the jobs we lose here. Would you rather lose all the jobs to a different country or some of the jobs to immigration reform.

4. Build programs and assistance to help them actually come here and offer them jobs. These employers can hire them from a pool of some sort. They would have to offer certain things to make sure the immigrant has a decent transition. Maybe some housing provided by larger employers.


5. Stricter and stiffer penalties on companies who are caught hiring "illegals" This is one thing that people never seem to think about. Is it easier to get to the companies or the illegal aliens. There are penalties but they are not stiff enough. I have seen bus loads of "illegal immigrants" shipped out from a company. Only for that same company to have another 50 back with in a week.

You need to stop blaming the people that come here and look at the enablers ie companies offering the jobs and such.

Easy to say for someone living in Wisconsin. As someone that lives in Arizona, I fully support the law. Illegal immigration is a huge problem here. I am for immigration as long as it is legal and so is the majority of the hispanic people that I know. As far as profiling goes, it definitely sucks but there will always be people that judge others based on race and creed. You can not legislate morality effectively or else we would still be living with prohibition.

 

[LotsOfZeros]

agree with you that they are taking advantage of our healthcare system and school systems, but taking away jobs from US citizens is a stretch. They do all the crap jobs that Americans won't.

I'm not entirely against this new law, just the way it might get applied. I think immigrants need to go through the legal processes of coming here, and they need to pay their fair share of taxes. I do see an opportunity for a lot of discrimination and hate, which really won't help this for either side.

LOL liberal talking points
liberal talking points LOL

 

[invisible777]

Easy to say for someone living in Wisconsin. As someone that lives in Arizona, I fully support the law.

LOL. Utter pwnage.

 

[Netphase]

Just want to hear what WF has to say about it, I for pretty much think that its stupid that LA had to get involved with it by boycotting Arizona.

Arizona utility board offers to help Los Angeles with their boycott of Arizona by cutting electricity from Arizona. :thumbsup:

The Los Angeles City Council voted to boycott the state of Arizona over its new immigration-enforcement law, and now the Arizona Corporation Commission has responded. Gary Pierce, one of the commissioners chosen in state-wide elections to the utility regulation panel, notes that Los Angeles gets about 25% of its power from Arizona producers. If the City of Angels really wants a boycott, Pierce offers his services to help, as he explains in a letter to Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa

More here.....

Hot Air AZ utility board member responds to LA boycott over SB1070

PDF Scan of the letter.....

http://hotair.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/letter-azcc-villaraigosa.pdf.pdf

 

[AdExhibitJason]

Easy to say for someone living in Wisconsin. As someone that lives in Arizona, I fully support the law. Illegal immigration is a huge problem here. I am for immigration as long as it is legal and so is the majority of the hispanic people that I know. As far as profiling goes, it definitely sucks but there will always be people that judge others based on race and creed. You can not legislate morality effectively or else we would still be living with prohibition.

You failed to even get the point of my post.

The immigration BS they are doing is racial profiling so it IS RACIST>


How can you compare morality and this situation to something like prohibition. All this new crap law does is give racist asshole a reason to be even BIGGER RACIST ASSHOLES.

There will never be any decent reform because both sides of the political isle bicker like big fucking babies and just cannot learn how to meet in the middle of anything.


This whole country was and is built on immigrants, legal and illegal. We used to make it fairly easy for people to immgrate here but now have made it damn near impossible.


All I am saying is make the borders more open. Stop prosecuting the "illegals" and go after the companies. They are the ones adding fuel to the fire. The companies and rich people, you hire an illegal immigrant and pay them under the table YOU GO TO FUCKING JAIL. As simple as that.

Take away the enabler instead of the people just here to actually work.

 

[mont7071]

Judging by some of the statements (on both sides of the debate) being passed off as gospel here, I think over 50% of the posters here obviously haven't actually READ the law.

Try reading it, I know I know, that's 15 minutes that could be better spent watching American Idol or posting witty Gifs, but there are way too many self-proclaimed "experts" on what this law supposedly says that are not getting their info from the source.

 

[Bubbish]

I don't have a lot of time to read the bill, But I will watch a youtube video:


[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WgOHOHKBEqE&feature=popular"]YouTube- Broadcast Yourself.[/ame]


I Agree with the law. It's about time someone did SOMETHING about the problem. Everyone wants to talk about it, but AZ finally said fuck it and is trying to fix the problem.

 

[FerrisHilton]

All I am saying is make the borders more open. Stop prosecuting the "illegals" and go after the companies. They are the ones adding fuel to the fire. The companies and rich people, you hire an illegal immigrant and pay them under the table YOU GO TO FUCKING JAIL. As simple as that.

Take away the enabler instead of the people just here to actually work.

OH GOD YES Lets send business owners to jail instead of sending the illegal immigrants back to mexico AMIRITE?

 

[hectic]

Uh, the reason that people are upset is because the law targets American citizens too... just the brown ones. If the police "reasonably suspect that you might be an illegal immigrant" they can stop you and ask for papers.

It would be different if Arizona wrote a law saying that every US citizen in AZ had to carry papers proving citizenship, and any time the police stopped anyone (white, black or brown) they had to prove their citizenship. But that isn't what they did.

 

[Air2air]

mont7071 I agree - Here is an excellent example of someone who is reading DailyKos instead of the facts:

The immigration BS they are doing is racial profiling so it IS RACIST....All this new crap law does is give racist asshole a reason to be even BIGGER RACIST ASSHOLES.

Writing your opinion in all caps shows that you don't have facts to back up that opinion, so you must emphasize your point with punctuation.

There will never be any decent reform because both sides of the political isle bicker like big fucking babies and just cannot learn how to meet in the middle of anything.

Jason that is called discussion and debate. Since 80% of the country disagrees with you, it is understandable that you would prefer not to have a discussion at all.

This whole country was and is built on immigrants, legal and illegal. We used to make it fairly easy for people to immgrate here but now have made it damn near impossible.

Arizona takes in 700,000 Latino immigrants legally every year.

They are the ones adding fuel to the fire. The companies and rich people

Why are you here on WF when everyone here is:

1. Trying to become rich
2. Either has their own company or works for one.

 

[Air2air]

Uh, the reason that people are upset is because the law targets American citizens too... just the brown ones. If the police "reasonably suspect that you might be an illegal immigrant" they can stop you and ask for papers.

Hectic that is not what the law says. It says that illegal immigrants must carry the same papers that legal immigrants do. This makes for fair treatment for everybody.

You cannot be stopped for being "brown". Who would support that? There are many "brown" people in the US.

If, however, you are being detained for another infraction, the officer can ask to see your legal immigration papers.

It would be different if Arizona wrote a law saying that every US citizen in AZ had to carry papers proving citizenship, and any time the police stopped anyone (white, black or brown) they had to prove their citizenship. But that isn't what they did.

Hectic that is exactly what they did. Arizona is treating everyone equally now. Nobody is above the law; it is fair across the board now.

We all have driver's licenses, and we have to show them to the police. If we don't, we are taken into custody.

 

[hectic]

Hectic that is exactly what they did. Arizona is treating everyone equally now. Nobody is above the law; it is fair across the board now.

We all have driver's licenses, and we have to show them to the police. If we don't, we are taken into custody.

If it were a perfect world, I would agree with you Air2Air.

But we all know that isn't the way things really work.

If you are stopped for something else, and you don't have ID, maybe the police will take you into custody, and maybe they won't. Depending on what you are stopped for, whether you are white, whether you have an accent, etc.

The law would save them the trouble of even having to make up something (broken tail light, looked high, etc.) since it would make the very act of possibly being an illegal immigrant grounds for being stopped.

 

[Air2air]

Hectic I lived in San Francisco for about a quarter of my life and got used to the "But we all know that isn't the way (wink wink) things really work" statement.

It works for everything, from "Bush blew up the WTC" to "Blood for Oil".

It keeps you from having to provide evidence, because it's a (hush-hush / wink-wink) secret conspiracy.

Hey BTW hectic.com is a cool little site and service. Looks great.

 

[hectic]

Nothing hush hush about it, ask your black or brown friends what they think.

Disclaimer: I am a white dude who lives in a 70% latino neighborhood in SF and I love it. So certainly biased. ;-)

Thanks for the props on Hectic.com, trying to do something with that domain after all these years.

 

[Air2air]

My dotcom's office was in 16th and Mission in 2000.

The way we white dudes would get chicks was to tell them how horrible we white, straight dudes are, and how greedy and racist. And that being a minority means you are a victim. And that America is the greatest evil in the world. And if you disagree, you're a redneck.

The panties would drop to the floor.

After a few generations of that, voila - you have modern San Francisco. Where that storyline gives the whole city a reason to wake up in the morning.

 

[papajohn56]

FOXNews.com - Arizona Official Threatens to Cut Off Los Angeles Power as Payback for Boycott

l o l they want to cut the power to LA now

 

[JarredLv]

You failed to even get the point of my post.

The immigration BS they are doing is racial profiling so it IS RACIST>

Racial profiling does not equal racism. Racism is the illogical hatred of a person based on the color of their skin or their nation of origin. ILLOGICAL HATRED. Racial profiling on the other hand is just math. Statistics. If 80% of one type of crime is committed by persons of a specific race or national origin, it is simple logic and math to know that odds are, people who commit this crime will be of a specific race. But it is just so easy for one to try and label anyone who supports Arizona defending itself racist.


And, where are the boycotts of California (hypocrite much?)

Calif. Penal Code Sec. 834b

834b. (a) Every law enforcement agency in California shall fully cooperate with the United States Immigration and Naturalization Service regarding any person who is arrested if he or she is suspected of being present in the United States in violation of federal immigration laws.

(b) With respect to any such person who is arrested, and suspected of being present in the United States in violation of federal immigration laws, every law enforcement agency shall do the following:

(1) Attempt to verify the legal status of such person as a citizen of the United States, an alien lawfully admitted as a permanent resident, an alien lawfully admitted for a temporary period of time or as an alien who is present in the United States in violation of immigration laws. The verification process may include, but shall not be limited to, questioning the person regarding his or her date and place of birth, and entry into the United States, and demanding documentation to indicate his or her legal status.

(2) Notify the person of his or her apparent status as an alien who is present in the United States in violation of federal immigration laws and inform him or her that, apart from any criminal justice proceedings, he or she must either obtain legal status or leave the United States.

(3) Notify the Attorney General of California and the United States Immigration and Naturalization Service of the apparent illegal status and provide any additional information that may be requested by any other public entity.

(c) Any legislative, administrative, or other action by a city, county, or other legally authorized local governmental entity with jurisdictional boundaries, or by a law enforcement agency, to prevent or limit the cooperation required by subdivision (a) is expressly prohibited.

 

[taktikz]

You failed to even get the point of my post.

The immigration BS they are doing is racial profiling so it IS RACIST>


How can you compare morality and this situation to something like prohibition. All this new crap law does is give racist asshole a reason to be even BIGGER RACIST ASSHOLES.

There will never be any decent reform because both sides of the political isle bicker like big fucking babies and just cannot learn how to meet in the middle of anything.


This whole country was and is built on immigrants, legal and illegal. We used to make it fairly easy for people to immgrate here but now have made it damn near impossible.


All I am saying is make the borders more open. Stop prosecuting the "illegals" and go after the companies. They are the ones adding fuel to the fire. The companies and rich people, you hire an illegal immigrant and pay them under the table YOU GO TO FUCKING JAIL. As simple as that.

Take away the enabler instead of the people just here to actually work.

Agreed. This is simply racial profiling.

Surprised this wasn't used after 9/11 to identify the "terrorists" which are the actual threat to the US!

Funny how those in this thread for this bill didn't care to mention the ban of ethnic studies in Arizona as well?
Is that kool too?

 

[Steroids]

A national ID card would solve all the racial profiling problems. Any encounter with a police officer or a government agency would require you to show your national ID card. The card can be based on the new Passport Cards that are being issued. You can embed biometric data to make it more secure.

The side benefit would be all the illegals who overstayed their visitor visas can be tracked down, and anyone with outstanding warrants can also be tracked down.

It's an obvious solution that uses existing technology, can easily be implemented, and the burden can equally be shared by all citizens... not just the citizens who happen to "look like an illegal".

 

[stmadeveloper]

A national ID card would solve all the racial profiling problems. Any encounter with a police officer or a government agency would require you to show your national ID card. The card can be based on the new Passport Cards that are being issued. You can embed biometric data to make it more secure.

The side benefit would be all the illegals who overstayed their visitor visas can be tracked down, and anyone with outstanding warrants can also be tracked down.

It's an obvious solution that uses existing technology, can easily be implemented, and the burden can equally be shared by all citizens... not just the citizens who happen to "look like an illegal".

But of course this would lead to Armageddon.

Glen Beck actually read all 10 pages of the bill on the radio today apparently. That means there will be a whole bunch of right wingers that now actually KNOW what it says

I've read it as well -- but it's a normal bill that pretty much says:

Cops: Do your normal job. If someone doesn't have ID in the course of being arrested, traffic violation, etc... follow the FEDERAL law in regard to being here illegally.

How is that racist? Unless you just say "hey everyone come on in - everyone is welcome", there must be some enforcement of our laws.