"We have to pass this bill [health care], so that you can find out what is in it"

[kblessinggr]

Solid gold analysis.

It's basic opportunity costs, which everyone human being, and certainly every marketer, *should* be able to understand. But most people don't learn how to use deductive reasoning (critical thinking), and that is why some will only see "More free stuff for Moms!" instead of the unseen, "This could cost Moms' jobs!"

Of course, when Moms get less jobs, there will be more regulations, which force businesses to hire Moms without discrimination, even when discriminatory pro-Mom regulation makes them more expensive to employ.

Every intervention creates the next crisis.

Kinda like how when companies started offering flextime because it would possibly make workers more productive in less time and as a result cost the company less money. But due to the recession and fear of job loss, more people are opting to work longer hours in the office for fear of loosing their jobs if they're the 'unseen worker', thus being counter-productive to the whole reason flex-time was offered.

 

[dreamache]

Here's another little gem they uncovered:

- A new federal mandate on businesses of 51 or more employees to provide a private area (not a bathroom) for nursing mothers to pump breast milk for up to a year after giving birth. This means that businesses have to plan for mainly unused floor space in every facility, or face federal sanctions.

Well because my wife is in the thick of it now with breast feeding (3 month old daughter), this doesn't sound all that bad.

Obviously a nursing mother needs to breastpump if they're away at work for say 8+ hours (potentially up to 3 times), they have to otherwise their supply will decrease because the demand is not there, which is bad.

Now, having to breastpump in a tiny, smelly piece of shit bathroom would suck and be quite difficult.

Trust me though, I hate big government and them sticking their noses in shit, and while you're right about it being "mainly unused" because so few mothers breastfeed anymore, the few that do could be forced into a shitty bathroom which would really suck at the same time too.. If the company has over 51 employees, finding the space shouldn't be an issue.

In this case, an argument could be made that legislation forcing companies to provide maternity leave led to unintended consequences. The same will likely be true of legislation forcing them to provide space to pump. The only unknown variable is the nature of those consequences. This is the stumbling block of all central planners (whether they realize it or not).

This also makes sense along with what "guerilla" said. So perhaps just doing their business in a bathroom IS the best route ultimately.

 

[guerilla]

Kinda like how when companies started offering flextime because it would possibly make workers more productive in less time and as a result cost the company less money. But due to the recession and fear of job loss, more people are opting to work longer hours in the office for fear of loosing their jobs if they're the 'unseen worker', thus being counter-productive to the whole reason flex-time was offered.

That's an interesting observation. It's not the same as the point I was making, but interesting nonetheless. There is always an unseen (less obvious) component to every decision, because each decision is a trade off between two or more choices.

You make another good point. Companies that want to retain good employees will cater to their needs. There are LOTS of companies which provide benefits above and beyond but to get jobs with those companies, you need to actually be a very productive member of society. The incentive to be more productive, is that there are more rewards. That's just basic common sense. You don't pay good and mediocre employees equally. That's why socialism doesn't work. There is no incentive to be great.

 

[kblessinggr]

That's an interesting observation. It's not the same as the point I was making, but interesting nonetheless. There is always an unseen (less obvious) component to every decision, because each decision is a trade off between two or more choices.

You make another good point. Companies that want to retain good employees will cater to their needs. There are LOTS of companies which provide benefits above and beyond but to get jobs with those companies, you need to actually be a very productive member of society. The incentive to be more productive, is that there are more rewards. That's just basic common sense. You don't pay good and mediocre employees equally. That's why socialism doesn't work. There is no incentive to be great.

Pretty much, thats why even though the people spending more hours at the office are there seen working hard, are probably not working smart, as they'll be more likely to be fired if they are not as productive as the person working less hours (but yet more productive because they are happier and less stressful).

But yes straight socialism in every aspect of society won't work on it's own, yet you can't have it both ways. I guess why it sucks is because health is something we all need as human beings. But rather than nationalizing health care we should be putting control back into doctor's and patient's hands instead of administrators and bureaucrats.

 

[consigliere]

I despise Nancy Pelosi and politics generally, but to be fair it's extremely hard to take something seriously when it's a sub-five-second fragment of a sentence that person said.


Frank

haha yeah i agree its just a snippet, but the whole mindset is consistent with what she was trying to do. i mean, who had time to read thousands of pages of the bill before voting on it??

 

[Roundabout]

- A new federal mandate on businesses of 51 or more employees to provide a private area (not a bathroom) for nursing mothers to pump breast milk for up to a year after giving birth.

CEO's should be allowed to suckle the breast and extract the milk as an alternative.

 

[JustFU]

Here's some more context:

Straight from the stupid bitches own site...

http://www.speaker.gov/newsroom/pressreleases?id=1576

“You’ve heard about the controversies within the bill, the process about the bill, one or the other. But I don’t know if you have heard that it is legislation for the future, not just about health care for America, but about a healthier America, where preventive care is not something that you have to pay a deductible for or out of pocket. Prevention, prevention, prevention—it’s about diet, not diabetes. It’s going to be very, very exciting.

“But we have to pass the bill so that you can find out what is in it, away from the fog of the controversy. Furthermore, we believe that health care reform, again I said at the beginning of my remarks, that we sent the three pillars that the President’s economic stabilization and job creation initiatives were education and innovation—innovation begins in the classroom—clean energy and climate, addressing the climate issues in an innovative way to keep us number one and competitive in the world with the new technology, and the third, first among equals I may say, is health care, health insurance reform. Health insurance reform is about jobs. This legislation alone will create 4 million jobs, about 400,000 jobs very soon.

“We must have the courage, though, to get the job done. We have the ideas. We have the commitment. We have the dedication. We know the urgency. Now we have to have the courage to get the job done. So proud that President Obama is taking the message so forcefully to the American people! This is long overdue, a hundred years. ...

 

[.Hack]

JUDGE KITHIL wrote: "I have reviewed selected sections of the bill, and find
it unbelievable that our Congress, led by Speaker Nancy Pelosi, could come up with a bill loaded with so many wrong-headed elements."











"Both Republicans and Democrats are equally responsible
for the financial mess of both Social Security and Medicare programs."

"I am opposed to HB 3200 for a number of reasons. ​

To start with, it is estimated that a federal bureaucracy of more than 150,000 new employees will be required to administer HB3200. That is an unacceptable expansion of a government that is already too intrusive in our lives. If we are going to hire 150,000 new employees, let's put them to
work protecting our borders, fighting the massive drug problem and putting more law enforcement/firefighters out there."


JUDGE KITHIL continued: "Other problems I have with
this bill include:

** Page 50/section 152: The bill will provide insurance
to all non-U.S. residents, even if they are here illegally.

** Page 58 and 59: The government will have
real-time access to an individual's bank account and will have the authority to make electronic fund transfers from those accounts.

** Page 65/section 164: The plan will be subsidized (by
the government) for all union members, union retirees and for community organizations (such as the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now - ACORN).

** Page 203/line 14-15: The tax imposed under this
section will not be treated as a tax. (How could anybody in their right mind come up with that?)

** Page 241 and 253: Doctors will all be paid the same
regardless of specialty, and the government will set all doctors' fees.

** Page 272. section 1145: Cancer hospital will ration
care according to the patient's age.

** Page 317 and 321: The government will impose a
prohibition on hospital expansion; however, communities may petition for an exception.

** Page 425, line 4-12: The government mandates
advance-care planning consultations. Those on Social Security will be required to attend an "end-of-life planning" seminar every five years. (Death counceling.)

** Page 429, line 13-25: The government will specify
which doctors can write an end-of-life order.

HAD ENOUGH???? Judge Kithil then goes on:

"Finally, it is specifically stated that this bill will not
apply to members of Congress. Members of Congress are already exempt from the Social Security system, and have a well-funded private plan that covers their retirement needs. If they were on our Social Security plan, I believe they would find a very quick 'fix' to make the plan financially sound for their future."

Honorable David Kithil
Marble Falls , Texas

All of the above should give you the point blank
ammo you need to support your opposition to Obamacare. Please send this information on to all of your email contacts.​

 

[JustFU]

All ur rights an liberties belong to us