Ruby, Python or PHP?

[stonelove]

Thanks Ed, I just need a language that helps me deploy a few business concepts I have into a web app. I'd like to build it, SEO it and see how it performs in the face of real life customers. I'm leaning towards Ruby because I want to do it quick, fast and dirty. it doesn't have to nice and clean for the 1.0 version, the real test is if it's a hit or not.

I figure if it's a hit I can always have it re-written in whatever code. but i've seen a lot of instances where people spend ages and tons of money, resources building something nobody wants.

Thanks for all the great responses so far.

PHP, Ruby, AND Python. Learn em all

They all have their benefits, pro's and cons. Start with PHP to learn the basics. Move onto Ruby/Rails/python ---- it will be easier to grasp things there once you have done a few php apps.

In the end though you will probably do more stuff with php, and back end stuff with python/rails.

 

[LazyHippy]

PHP and a bit of perl here. Want to find the time to get to know Ruby and then prob Python - can def see it becoming more popular.

I'm not gonna claim to be a real programmer, but then I don't need to know exactly which 1s and 0s are doing what. I only need to know enough to do what I need (or to find something to do what I need or hire someone and know what's needed from them).

One of the reasons php is so easy is there is just so much stuff out there - why re-invent the wheel when you can use phpclasses.org or any number of other sites and save time? Any problem and you can bet a quick search will find others who've had the same probs and the solutions. For those reasons alone I would start with php.

You'll naturally pick up a lot as you go along. I don't see much point to trying to learn any programming language just for the sake of knowing it if you aren't going to use it. Get an understanding of them all, it's more useful to focus on how the language is structured, what does what and why, rather than memorising the syntax, functions, etc. Find other people's code and hack it up to do what you want - much more interesting and productive way of learning than reading an O'Reilly book.

 

[-Matt-]

Perl.






Or PHP if Perl is not an option.

 

[WebRef.eu]

PHP and MySQL is good for newbies as there are lots of free tutorials and scripts for it and that is a major plus.

 

[smaxor]

It's not about learning it for web development, it's about learning the fundamentals of programming. And C is NOT difficult to learn.




Bullshit!

I've written a shitload of web apps in C. Some standalone and some that work alongside Perl and Python apps like web services that utilize SQLite, MySQL, etc., etc.



You don't know what the fuck you're talking about, STFU




And the open source web apps have to be updated and patched on almost a daily basis because of the numerous security flaws.

Try managing a bunch of sites filled with that open source PHP shit, you'll spend all of your time updating/patching, removing spam, and trying to figure out how your site was hacked.

The reason PHP is so popular is that it basically took the "programming" out of programming and because of the ease of integrating the code into an html page.



But very few know proper programming techniques because they learned that junk "language" first.



lol


I agree that PHP is currently the the most popular option, but that's just because anyone who can learn a few functions and echo "I is a interwebs programmer" can use it.

C Hahahahahaha you and I are in very different businesses if that's your suggestion for the best language to learn for dev'ing web apps, sites and utitilties. Not saying C isn't a fine language it is. But by no means is it more useful for what we do then every web cemtroc language ( perl, php, ruby, python, asp, etc ) out there.

If you want to go that route learn Java for god's sake. Way more useful for web based dev then C. But again not at all necessary.

 

[Gumby!]

C Hahahahahaha you and I are in very different businesses if that's your suggestion for the best language to learn for dev'ing web apps, sites and utitilties. Not saying C isn't a fine language it is. But by no means is it more useful for what we do then every web cemtroc language ( perl, php, ruby, python, asp, etc ) out there.

If you want to go that route learn Java for god's sake. Way more useful for web based dev then C. But again not at all necessary.

Jeezus, I never suggested he learn it to write web apps. I suggested he start there to learn the fundamentals.

Just about all of those "web cemtroc" languages you mentioned a written in C, if you know c you have a better understanding of the language

 

[Gumby!]

You're an idiot.

Fuck you, PHP-tard

 

[tweak50]

I personally learned c++ as my first language and wouldn't change it for the world.
Every language I have encountered after learning c++ was a walk in the park.
There is no such thing as a 'silver bullet' programming language, so my recommendation would be to learn as much of them as possible.

Just my .02

 

[tweak50]

You don't know what the fuck you're talking about, STFU

Ummm...what? Are you trying to say that there isn't a difference between C and C++?

 

[che1959]

I personally learned c++ as my first language and wouldn't change it for the world.
Every language I have encountered after learning c++ was a walk in the park.
There is no such thing as a 'silver bullet' programming language, so my recommendation would be to learn as much of them as possible.

Just my .02

Agreed. If you are planning on learning several languages, a good solid basis makes learning other languages easy. My first real language was FORTRAN and then COBOL, Assembler and Pascal followed by C. I know the basics of the logic that makes up a program and why the commands do the things they do. Any other languages is easier that way.

One of the reasons php is so easy is there is just so much stuff out there - why re-invent the wheel when you can use phpclasses.org or any number of other sites and save time? Any problem and you can bet a quick search will find others who've had the same probs and the solutions. For those reasons alone I would start with php.

I remember hearing that great programming advice from my comp professor. It's easier to tweak and expand on someone else's work than start from scratch on a new project.


Me? Most of my programming is in PHP. it's easy to write the code and just about every web server is set up to handle it. I am learning Python and Django, but PHP is dirty easy to write in.

 

[Gumby!]

Ummm...what? Are you trying to say that there isn't a difference between C and C++?

Of course not, didn't you read the part I quoted where he said "And you'd go for C++, not plain-old C."? I'm assuming the answer is no or you wouldn't haved asked such a stupid question. What, did you think you were going to pounce on me for fucking up, good luck.

Damn, doesn't anyone take the time to read and comprehend a thread before responding and looking like an ass?

 

[tweak50]

Of course not, didn't you read the part I quoted where he said "And you'd go for C++, not plain-old C."? I'm assuming the answer is no or you wouldn't haved asked such a stupid question. What, did you think you were going to pounce on me for fucking up, good luck.

Damn, doesn't anyone take the time to read and comprehend a thread before responding and looking like an ass?

Yeah I actually did read the comment ass. And your response does not make sense. Since, of course, there is a difference in C++ and C, how does he not know what he's talking about by saying to learn the better of the two languages?

Damn, doesn't anyone take the time to read and comprehend a thread before responding and looking like an ass?

Maybe it's time to start taking your own advice, hmmmm??

 

[Gumby!]

Yeah I actually did read the comment ass. And your response does not make sense. Since, of course, there is a difference in C++ and C,

There's a difference between C and C++? Wow, thanks for clearing that up Captain Obvious.

how does he not know what he's talking about by saying to learn the better of the two languages?

It's ovious that he doesn't know either language and was talking out of his ass, kinda like you are now. And saying that C++ is better than C is like saying Apples are better than Steak, it makes absolutely no sense

Maybe it's time to start taking your own advice, hmmmm??

Maybe it's time for you to STFU

 

[tweak50]

There's a difference between C and C++? Wow, thanks for clearing that up Captain Obvious.



It's ovious that he doesn't know either language and was talking out of his ass, kinda like you are now. And saying that C++ is better than C is like saying Apples are better than Steak, it makes absolutely no sense



Maybe it's time for you to STFU

I should have just listened to supergeek, you are an idiot.

 

[Gumby!]

I should have just listened to supergeek, you are an idiot.

Coming from a douchebag like you, that's a compliment.

And thanks for the negative rep crybaby, I'll wear it like a badge of honor.

Now run along, your mother has a cheese sandwich for you.

 

[BrooklynBlue]

dick-waving over programming languages is funny

 

[Gumby!]

dick-waving over programming languages is funny

 

[bluebuddha]

As a programmer, you absolutely must learn C, or anything that level or lower which will teach you how your OS and computer work.

Obviously, C isn't practical for web development, and personally, I don't think PHP is that practical either (anymore), - at least for my purposes - unless you use a framework.

I can't decide between Ruby and Python. Ruby is better than Python in every way except for Python's performance, community and in terms of how mature it is over Ruby.

Those aside, Ruby is a programmer's dream. Ruby is like the offspring of perl (power, flexiblity) and python (elegance, maintainability), with a little Lisp mixed in.

Performance *is* an issue, but I don't consider it a problem for 99-100% of the things you'll be using it for. And Ruby 2.0 is going to fix most of the performance problems.

As far as frameworks go, I'd go with Merb when it's more mature, but at the moment Rails is sweet. And Django if you go the python route. PHP has a bunch of MVC frameworks. PHP-WAX, etc..

 

[tweak50]

As far as frameworks go, I'd go with Merb when it's more mature, but at the moment Rails is sweet. And Django if you go the python route. PHP has a bunch of MVC frameworks. PHP-WAX, etc..

I've been fucking around with cakePHP(mvc framework) the last week or so, it actually makes me want to dive deeper into php again.

I do agree with learning c or c++ as a first language though. The first class I took was an advance c++ data structures class. Nearly failed it, but I am a far better programmer today because of it.

 

[Supergeek]

I'm thinking of taking up a framework to help speed things up. I can do whatever I want in PHP, but the MVC model is starting to appeal to me because I've built some shitty stuff that has become difficult to maintain because of HTML embedded in PHP, etc. Usually because I start out small to do proof of concept, then just keep adding on.

For those who have done a PHP framework (Cake et al) AND a Ruby framework (Rails), have you noticed any big advantages of one over the other?