Obama supports plan for mosque near ground zero
- Thread starter ly2 from WF
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Hopefully no fundraising. Correct me if I am wrong, but I don't see any evidence to suggest he has done any fundraising during his past two trips.
What did he really say about Sharia law? You and I both know how easy it is to take a quote and make it out to be something that it isn't. I am not an expert on the guy so I guess I don't know one way or another.
I don't think anyone is intending the guy to represent every American, but its hard to deny that outreach with the Muslim world can only be positive for our image (and by extension, our security).
He also "represented" the last administration during his first trip in 2007. I don't personally think he should be tied to any specific administration... this is a State Dept. program that is nothing new. The state dept probably has 100 other outreach programs just like it. Its not really a big deal.
we've got to drop this us vs. them mentality
Like others have said here, it's merely a matter of respect. It has nothing to do with "founding Principles that our country was built on" lol. It's simple respect. Move the damn thing down the road a ways. It's not like they're trying to kick Muslims out of the country.
I can tell you right now that Christians are being burned at the stake in Iran - just for being Christian. And that's a fact. So don't come in here and spew some BS about it being intolerant to ask them to move their building down the road. If it's small enough to fit into a Burlington Coat factory, then all the more reason it should be simple for them to move it if they had any respect.
It's the same argument when you see someone burn the flag. Yes, of course you're glad you live in a Country where we have the freedom to do it - yadayada. But you'd still like to put your foot up the arse of anyone you see doing it. It still comes down to Fucking respect.
Yes of course freedom of religion - blah blah - Grow some balls you shriveled wusses. It's about respect.
I can tell you right now that Christians are being burned at the stake in Iran - just for being Christian. And that's a fact. So don't come in here and spew some BS about it being intolerant to ask them to move their building down the road. If it's small enough to fit into a Burlington Coat factory, then all the more reason it should be simple for them to move it if they had any respect.
It's the same argument when you see someone burn the flag. Yes, of course you're glad you live in a Country where we have the freedom to do it - yadayada. But you'd still like to put your foot up the arse of anyone you see doing it. It still comes down to Fucking respect.
Yes of course freedom of religion - blah blah - Grow some balls you shriveled wusses. It's about respect.
No one is saying that they don't have the right to build there if it is on the up and up (I believe it is being funded by terror groups). What millions of Americans are stating is that it is insensetive. If this Imam really believed in helping muslim/west relations than he would move the thing to actually help relations.
http://www.examiner.com/religion-so...-we-been-told-the-truth-about-the-9-11-mosque Here is some of the troublesome stances that this Imam takes on sharia and America being a culprit in 911. He also will not denounce Hamas.
I have to wonder though why they would have to think of it as respectful to not have a mosques there, were there no muslims working in the WTC? Not to mention It'd only be disrespectful if the members of that mosque were responsible for the fall of WTC. I'm not muslim, but if I were I'd probably be thinking "wtf? I didn't bomb you, and I don't agree with anyone that did, so why am I having to shun my faith out of 'respect' for you?", or something along that line.
Hell yeah it's insensitive but there's no point in me getting all pissy about it because whether I like it or not I believe that everyone in this country has to be treated fairly because the constitution says so. My issue is with everyone attacking Obama because he's saying what he HAS to say.
Partial List of Muslim 9/11 Victims:
- Samad Afridi
- Ashraf Ahmad
- Shabbir Ahmad (45 years old; Windows on the World; leaves wife and 3 children)
- Umar Ahmad
- Azam Ahsan
- Ahmed Ali
- Tariq Amanullah (40 years old; Fiduciary Trust Co.; ICNA website team member; leaves wife and 2 children)
- Touri Bolourchi (69 years old; United Airlines #175; a retired nurse from Tehran)
- Salauddin Ahmad Chaudhury
- Abdul K. Chowdhury (30 years old; Cantor Fitzgerald)
- Mohammad S. Chowdhury (39 years old; Windows on the World; leaves wife and child born 2 days after the attack)
- Jamal Legesse Desantis
- Ramzi Attallah Douani (35 years old; Marsh & McLennan)
- SaleemUllah Farooqi
- Syed Fatha (54 years old; Pitney Bowes)
- Osman Gani
- Mohammad Hamdani (50 years old)
- Salman Hamdani (NYPD Cadet)
- Aisha Harris (21 years old; General Telecom)
- Shakila Hoque (Marsh & McLennan)
- Nabid Hossain
- Shahzad Hussain
- Talat Hussain
- Mohammad Shah Jahan (Marsh & McLennan)
- Yasmeen Jamal
- Mohammed Jawarta (MAS security)
- Arslan Khan Khakwani
- Asim Khan
- Ataullah Khan
- Ayub Khan
- Qasim Ali Khan
- Sarah Khan (32 years old; Cantor Fitzgerald)
- Taimour Khan (29 years old; Karr Futures)
- Yasmeen Khan
- Zahida Khan
- Badruddin Lakhani
- Omar Malick
- Nurul Hoque Miah (36 years old)
- Mubarak Mohammad (23 years old)
- Boyie Mohammed (Carr Futures)
- Raza Mujtaba
- Omar Namoos
- Mujeb Qazi
- Tarranum Rahim
- Ehtesham U. Raja (28 years old)
- Ameenia Rasool (33 years old)
- Naveed Rehman
- Yusuf Saad
- Rahma Salie & unborn child (28 years old; American Airlines #11; wife of Michael Theodoridis; 7 months pregnant)
- Shoman Samad
- Asad Samir
- Khalid Shahid (25 years old; Cantor Fitzgerald; engaged to be married in November)
- Mohammed Shajahan (44 years old; Marsh & McLennan)
- Naseema Simjee (Franklin Resources Inc.'s Fiduciary Trust)
- Jamil Swaati
- Sanober Syed
- Robert Elias Talhami (40 years old; Cantor Fitzgerald)
- Michael Theodoridis (32 years old; American Airlines #11; husband of Rahma Salie)
- W. Wahid
It would be shameful for us as a nation to be reaching out to our enemy "so they won't attack us anymore". That's total appeasement bullshit and I refuse to be motivated by fear. If our security is threatened (currently it is) then we need to react in kind and return the favor by blowing their sorry asses into tiny little pieces.
To find that building a mosque near WTC to be disrespectful, would likely be disrespectful to the following islamic victims of 9/11.
One above was an EMT named Salman Hamdani was suspected of being tied to the event until their remains found. The EMT above was found at the scene 6 months later with his EMT bag and such , possibly died from trying to save others at the scene.
So you want to talk bout respect? Seriously?
One above was an EMT named Salman Hamdani was suspected of being tied to the event until their remains found. The EMT above was found at the scene 6 months later with his EMT bag and such , possibly died from trying to save others at the scene.
So you want to talk bout respect? Seriously?
Again, no one is asking them to "shun" their faith. Just move it down the road... damn! It's like those baptist protesters that hold up the "you're going to hell" signs at the funerals of soldiers. They have every right to be there. But damn it's down right disrespectful as hell.
It's obvious that the mosque is upsetting people. No matter how misconceived the anger is, the anger is obviously there. So if they have any ounce of respect, and are truly NOT about upsetting relations. Then move the damn thing. I find it baffling the resistance to moving it. And the more resistance to moving, the more you give bait to the wacko conspiracy people that think it's being done out of pure malice.
I don't know why you are seeing it as reaching out to our enemy. We are reaching out to people who should be our friends - Abdul Rauf is visiting UAE, Bahrain and Qatar on this trip. Those are our allies - we have a lot of financial and business ties with them. The Gulf is a massive 21st century business hub.
Promoting understanding of our respective cultures brings us closer together. Look how much closer together the world has become in the 20th century - doing wonders for the world's overall prosperity/stability/peace.
Violence won't lead to peace...
... why should they have to move down the road? maybe they got a good price on the place, maybe it's ideally located to their patrons. When you boil it down any objection to them being there is just prejudice. I mean it may seem disrespectful to you if you're a christian and you associated the attack as being straight from Islam itself, but what bout the family of muslims who died in the attack, is it disrespectful to them to be told they shouldn't have a mosque anywhere near the site where their family members died, for the sake of not upsetting the "majority" religion of the land?
???????????????
Are you saying reaching out to other cultures is harmful to us?
Do you disagree that it is helpful?
Why is trying to change the popular image of the US/the West in the Muslim world a bad thing? Obviously we aren't reaching out to violent extremists/our enemies, we are reaching out to every day Muslims who influence the popular opinion/image of the West.
He's probably one of those people who feel that the act of "reaching out" to the middle east can be seen as a sign of submission.
the other thing to keep in mind is that some of the guys living in rural parts of the middle east really have no idea what the world is like outside of their surrounding area. i have met people who thought London was the capital of the United States. just meeting an American or someone who has lived in the US can really change their prejudices. It is helpful to see other cultures as individual people and not some distant group (and that goes for us as well as the people in the middle east).
Kinda like that.Coming up next in the outreach program: Swastikas, Statues of Kim Jong Il & Kim Sung Il (Juche ideology), Takbir & crescent flags etc.